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Post by AGD on Feb 3, 2020 17:20:26 GMT -5
I'd like to hear Mike and Bruce's side of it before getting too sanctimonious, but still I oppose trophy hunting in general. Cam - I hear no one from the event, itself, clarify just what the convention is representing; whether it is a broad spectrum family event or not. I highly doubt that they are teaching kids to hunt trophy animals. I wonder if they took a position and disavowed any type of trophy hunting - if it would make a difference if it stayed within the state regulated fisheries and game domains. If the organization did disavow the trophy hunting component, and there was still a furor - it would be clear that it was political, self-serving as to the petition originator, and calculated to hurt the band because of a perception that it was connected to Trump. And raise his personal profile. There is no better way to “get someone” is when one goes after their kids. Does not matter which party. Try reading the convention webpage.
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Post by AGD on Feb 3, 2020 17:24:20 GMT -5
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Post by filledeplage on Feb 3, 2020 17:29:50 GMT -5
Cam - I hear no one from the event, itself, clarify just what the convention is representing; whether it is a broad spectrum family event or not. I highly doubt that they are teaching kids to hunt trophy animals. I wonder if they took a position and disavowed any type of trophy hunting - if it would make a difference if it stayed within the state regulated fisheries and game domains. If the organization did disavow the trophy hunting component, and there was still a furor - it would be clear that it was political, self-serving as to the petition originator, and calculated to hurt the band because of a perception that it was connected to Trump. And raise his personal profile. There is no better way to “get someone” is when one goes after their kids. Does not matter which party. Try reading the convention webpage. Andrew - I read it - I am talking about the organization “now” making a statement or clarification in light of this furor that has erupted. And, not relying on the website that was created for the purposes of the event. It is a wide spectrum business. If their position changes in terms of “trophy hunting” would that not offset the rage and calm the situation down and bring a resolution to the issue?
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Post by AGD on Feb 3, 2020 17:33:55 GMT -5
Their position on trophy hunting will never change.
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Post by filledeplage on Feb 3, 2020 17:37:17 GMT -5
Their position on trophy hunting will never change. Stranger things have happened.
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petsite
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Post by petsite on Feb 3, 2020 17:37:41 GMT -5
This is also the group that in December of 1981 played Sun City South Africa during a UN ban on entertaining. With a FU attitude about the ban, Mike said it was good money so screw it. The band was later called out about doing this by the press along with several others, including Frank Sinatra.
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Post by filledeplage on Feb 3, 2020 17:40:24 GMT -5
The organization can not be unaware of what is going on. I think the ball is now in their court because it was generated from outside the US.
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Post by Emdeeh on Feb 3, 2020 18:45:15 GMT -5
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Post by Deleted on Feb 3, 2020 19:10:05 GMT -5
I very much hope that Mike and Bruce will not do the show. The history of The Beach Boys' sensitivity to ecology and the environment is well founded and one of their great contributions to the California culture from which they come come, and this is just extremely ugly and unpleasant. I have nothing against people exercising their proper rights, but there is something spectacularly ugly about the celebration of slaughtering innocent animals in this regard. The idea of this being a sport is something I have always considered a completely alien and in comprehensible. This event makes it particularly difficult for educators as we try to make a case for the on going significance and importance of The Beach Boys and their message for joy and harmony spanning many different decades of diverse political and cultural moments of American history. Considering all the kinds of shows they could do and the various causes but they could associate themselves with by way of consciousness and charity and publicity, I fail to see how trophy hunting could ever possibly have anything to do with their music, and I must agree with Brian and Alan in this regard. I can't imagine that Dave would approve, though I know he's not involved in the paperwork structure so Brian did not include him in his message. Normally when some weird event like this occurs, a teacher can turn it into a productive writing assignment, but in this particular case I would have no pleasure in enfolding this into the students' ongoing understanding of The Beach Boys and their commitment to the environment and to the major themes of human empathy and sensitivity to all of the created world. And of course this will feed into the many hatreds of Mike, and certainly it goes very much against many of the doctrines that he is so profoundly committed to in his study of transcendental meditation.
Anyway I just wanted to get some thoughts in there and be part of this community of great, healthy, frank and civilized discussion. And I can say very frankly that I am simply upset at this event and controversy.
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Post by John Manning on Feb 3, 2020 19:34:09 GMT -5
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petsite
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Post by petsite on Feb 3, 2020 20:27:10 GMT -5
This could be resolved SO quickly by Brian:
Hello, BMI? This is Brian Wilson. Yeah, I would like to pull the public performance license for my music from the group The Beach Boys. Ok, thanks!
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Post by jds on Feb 3, 2020 20:35:17 GMT -5
While not being familiar with the BMI by-laws, I imagine revoking the license would be much harder than this.
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Post by Mikie on Feb 3, 2020 20:35:22 GMT -5
Yeah, this has gone mainstream now. My ears perked up when I heard "Brian Wilson" and "Al Jardine" on the news on the way home from work today.
They now have 64,860 signatures on the petition - headed for 75K. That's about three or four average Beach Boys concert's worth of ticket holders!
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Post by Deleted on Feb 3, 2020 20:40:31 GMT -5
A better solution would be for all 5 surviving beach boys to have a press conference and announced that the gig has been canceled and that they are going to do a series of benefit shows for environmental causes such as ocean clean up. They are so capable of screwing things up all the time throughout the last 58 years but it's time that they collectively got together had a band meeting had a meeting with management and decided that their legacy is too precious and too important and too exalted to be diminished by something as stupid as this. Mike must have underestimated how fast information flies in this particular age , and if he had made a calculation he would have seen that revenues lost are going to far outweigh revenues gained through this one rather bizarre and alienating gig. If any one had suggested this scenario as an example of a bizarre and disastrous thing that could happen to The Beach Boys, we all would have laughed and considered it to be an absurd parody. This could be resolved SO quickly by Brian:
Hello, BMI? This is Brian Wilson. Yeah, I would like to pull the public performance license for my music from the group The Beach Boys. Ok, thanks!
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Post by Deleted on Feb 3, 2020 20:59:02 GMT -5
I was ecstatic when Brian changed Love and Mercy lyrics to sing about gun violence.
And I am thrilled to see him and Al stand up against this gratuitous and obsequious performance.
I think it is meaningful when an artist is willing to stand behind the message of their songs. I wouldn't enjoy Bob Dylan if he supported facist politicians. I wouldn't enjoy the Beatles if they donated to pro-war organizations. And it's difficult to enjoy the beach boys when they are supporting violence and general wickedness. It's not the message this band has delivered for 60 years. And it makes these members look like sacks of shit. There's my take, fire away if you will.
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Post by Custom Machine on Feb 3, 2020 22:28:38 GMT -5
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Post by Custom Machine on Feb 3, 2020 22:30:25 GMT -5
Followed Mike’s advice to have a cool head and a warm heart, which compelled me to follow Brian’s advice to sign the petition.
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petsite
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Post by petsite on Feb 3, 2020 22:54:41 GMT -5
My post on facebook:
Ok, this is weak and lame. I guess if the money is good, no matter is too big to stomp into the ground. Thought there would be more insight from a man who pro ports to love this planet and has spoken out so passionately in the past for conservation. Guess it was all just bullshit.
Monday night, Variety obtained a statement from Love, in response to the petition and Wilson’s support of it: “We look forward to a night of great music in Reno and, as always, support freedom of thought and expression as a fundamental tenet of our rights as Americans. Peace & Love, Mike Love.”
I say Brian, pull the performance rights!
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Post by AGD on Feb 4, 2020 1:26:05 GMT -5
This could be resolved SO quickly by Brian:
Hello, BMI? This is Brian Wilson. Yeah, I would like to pull the public performance license for my music from the group The Beach Boys. Ok, thanks!
Would it were so easy: in fact no artist could do that without months of litigation. In essence, anyone who pays the performance royalty can play the songs.
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petsite
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Post by petsite on Feb 4, 2020 1:58:39 GMT -5
This could be resolved SO quickly by Brian:
Hello, BMI? This is Brian Wilson. Yeah, I would like to pull the public performance license for my music from the group The Beach Boys. Ok, thanks!
Would it were so easy: in fact no artist could do that without months of litigation. In essence, anyone who pays the performance royalty can play the songs. I think that the only way it could happen quickly were if someone was licensed the rights to the public performances and then said something like "We are doing shows for NAMBLA or some other extreme group." You can fight on that principal. But it is true you can't do it quickly.
HOWEVER, I wonder if in the license for the Beach Boys name that there is a code on conduct as in most employment agreements. You can't sully the name of the company etc. by saying or doing things that will degrade the brand, ie: the above NAMBLA reference (hey it was on a South Park I watched tonight).
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Post by jds on Feb 4, 2020 3:04:08 GMT -5
I say Brian, pull the performance rights!
"Hey guys, let's give Brian Wilson potentially catastrophic veto powers over all company business (again.)" -- The Beach Boys, mid-80s.
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Post by John Manning on Feb 4, 2020 7:40:14 GMT -5
UK Guardian newspaper website today:
Petition has now topped 75,000, with a revised target of 150,000.
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Post by filledeplage on Feb 4, 2020 8:01:18 GMT -5
Would it were so easy: in fact no artist could do that without months of litigation. In essence, anyone who pays the performance royalty can play the songs. I think that the only way it could happen quickly were if someone was licensed the rights to the public performances and then said something like "We are doing shows for NAMBLA or some other extreme group." You can fight on that principal. But it is true you can't do it quickly.
HOWEVER, I wonder if in the license for the Beach Boys name that there is a code on conduct as in most employment agreements. You can't sully the name of the company etc. by saying or doing things that will degrade the brand, ie: the above NAMBLA reference (hey it was on a South Park I watched tonight).
The difference is that what NAMBLA does is banned by law (in the US) and what SCI does (within the regulations of each state - and not contrary to any federal rule) is not illegal. news.yahoo.com/more-1-000-pounds-shark-194433055.html There is an international group on board with this but certain groups demand this. awionline.org/content/international-shark-finning-bans-ends-and-policiesThis is where this petitioner should be - looking for some international agreement.
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Post by Cam Mott on Feb 4, 2020 8:22:42 GMT -5
This is like old Uncles. They are usually right and occasionally wrong (in your opinion) and sometimes arguing amongst themselves but they are still family and you still love them for the good while discouraging the bad.
(imagining Alan Thicke sitcom theme music playing in the background)
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Post by bryand on Feb 4, 2020 8:38:43 GMT -5
So a fundamental tenet of our rights as Americans is to go to other countries and kill their wildlife for sport? This is disgusting.
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