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Post by Mikie on Apr 6, 2020 18:57:13 GMT -5
Craig, do we have definitives on who played what on Beach Boys "In Concert '73"? The lead vocals aren't hard to distinguish, but do we pretty much just go by the musicians who were there at the time and what instruments/parts they normally played? I know a couple three guys switched off to different instruments sometimes. I'm not 100% sure about Wiki at this point. Took me years to find out who was behind the 8 ball on the inner sleeve.  |
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Post by craigslowinski on Apr 7, 2020 0:28:29 GMT -5
Craig, do we have definitives on who played what on Beach Boys "In Concert '73"? The lead vocals aren't hard to distinguish, but do we pretty much just go by the musicians who were there at the time and what instruments/parts they normally played? I know a couple three guys switched off to different instruments sometimes. I'm not 100% sure about Wiki at this point. Took me years to find out who was behind the 8 ball on the inner sleeve. The Wiki credits are basically correct (they came from me, after all!) - the parts about Kowalski playing lead guitar on "LTWB" and Moog on "SOS" came direct from the horse's mouth, to me (via telephone wire). He also told me he used to play bass on "Cool, Cool Water" live. However, the Daryl and Toni credits there are only partially correct - those two are only on the 1972 tracks (the dates for each track appear above the credit in Wiki). Likewise, Carli Munoz and Robert Kenyatta are only on the '73 tracks. And just who IS behind the 8 ball? I've heard Jack Reiley, since he'd supposedly been fired by the time it came out (doesn't look like his body style, though). |
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Post by Mikie on Apr 7, 2020 1:24:18 GMT -5
Craig, I saw that you were credited on Wiki - that's why I addressed the question to you here. To be specific, which instrument did Carl play on Sail On Sailor from the '73 Concert album? Electric piano? It could be misconstrued (by goofy fans like me) that he played lead guitar on the following: "Carl Wilson – vocals, lead guitar; electric piano on "Sail On, Sailor," "The Trader," "We Got Love," "Leaving This Town, and "Let the Wind Blow;" rhythm guitar on "Caroline, No"." Behind the 8-ball on the inner sleeve of the '73 Concert album is Carli Munoz, keyboard player and co-writer of most of the Bambu tracks. |
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Post by craigslowinski on Apr 7, 2020 1:33:05 GMT -5
Craig, I saw that you were credited on Wiki - that's why I addressed the question to you here. To be specific, which instrument did Carl play on Sail On Sailor from the '73 Concert album? Electric piano? It could be misconstrued (by goofy fans like me) that he played lead guitar on the following: "Carl Wilson – vocals, lead guitar; electric piano on "Sail On, Sailor," "The Trader," "We Got Love," "Leaving This Town, and "Let the Wind Blow;" rhythm guitar on "Caroline, No"." Behind the 8-ball on the inner sleeve of the '73 Concert album is Carli Munoz, keyboard player and co-writer of most of the Bambu tracks. Carl played electric piano on "Sail On, Sailor," "The Trader," "We Got Love," "Leaving This Town", and "Let the Wind Blow". He played rhythm guitar on "Caroline, No", and lead guitar on the others (co-lead with Blondie or Eddie, to be precise). |
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Post by Mikie on Apr 11, 2020 18:14:33 GMT -5
OK, I have a question. I don't have it in front of me, so please bare with me - I'm going by memory and not 100% sure about everything.
I know it can be heard on Unsurpassed Masters Vol. 6 (1964) The Alternate "All Summer Long" Album on the Sea Of Tunes label.
I think the session might be for "Girls On The Beach" at Western on May 19, an "All Summer Long" session.
Brian is in a good mood and is messing with a guy named "Bob" in the studio. Bob is not taking part in the fun and seems like a strict by-the-book guy, possibly with time constraints in mind. I assumed he was another Engineer at Western, but I don't see his name anywhere on the Internet.
Who's "Bob"?
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Post by craigslowinski on Apr 11, 2020 22:02:45 GMT -5
OK, I have a question. I don't have it in front of me, so please bare with me - I'm going by memory and not 100% sure about everything. I know it can be heard on Unsurpassed Masters Vol. 6 (1964) The Alternate "All Summer Long" Album on the Sea Of Tunes label. I think the session might be for "Girls On The Beach" at Western on May 19, an "All Summer Long" session. Brian is in a good mood and is messing with a guy named "Bob" in the studio. Bob is not taking part in the fun and seems like a strict by-the-book guy, possibly with time constraints in mind. I assumed he was another Engineer at Western, but I don't see his name anywhere on the Internet. Who's "Bob"? For some reason, there were two vocal sessions for "Girls On The Beach", and the results of this session - apparently at Capitol - went unused. A few years back, while writing essays for the MIC sessionography, I wrote the following, based on consultation with Alan Boyd on the subject: There's a bit of a mystery surrounding the recording of vocals for this track - no one has yet been able to ascertain the date the Boys filmed their parts for the movie, but logic would dictate that it was soon after the April 10th tracking date. However, a vocal session date of May 19th is indicated in both Capitol's files and on the track sheet attached to the tape reel box; but all takes on that reel are of an unused alternate vocal arrangement. Since the final vocals as released appear only on a separate (undated) tape, and were evidently recorded onto a different mono dubdown of the basic track and overdub, it appears the May 19th session was an afterthought - perhaps conducted in case they were restricted from releasing the movie version of the song on Capitol. For the May session, the Boys found themselves back at the Capitol Tower; dialog from the session tape indicates they were also recording there the night before (most likely overdubbing vocals for the All Summer Long album cut "Drive-In"), with the same engineer - a fellow referred to on tape as "Bob" - after spending the earlier part of that day recording vocals for two other songs, "We'll Run Away" and "Do You Remember?", at Western. |
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Post by Mikie on Apr 11, 2020 23:35:50 GMT -5
So "Bob" worked for Capitol? I just Googled "Bob recording engineer Capitol Records" and you know who I came up with? Bob Norberg. Not the same guy who was Brian's roommate, wrote songs with Brian, 'Bob & Sheri' fame, and member of 'The Survivors' who later became an airline pilot. But maybe the same Bob Norberg who later re-mastered Sinatra and Beach Boys recordings for Capitol?
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Post by Vale on Apr 12, 2020 2:12:25 GMT -5
OK, I have a question. I don't have it in front of me, so please bare with me - I'm going by memory and not 100% sure about everything. I know it can be heard on Unsurpassed Masters Vol. 6 (1964) The Alternate "All Summer Long" Album on the Sea Of Tunes label. I think the session might be for "Girls On The Beach" at Western on May 19, an "All Summer Long" session. Brian is in a good mood and is messing with a guy named "Bob" in the studio. Bob is not taking part in the fun and seems like a strict by-the-book guy, possibly with time constraints in mind. I assumed he was another Engineer at Western, but I don't see his name anywhere on the Internet. Who's "Bob"? Yes you are correct, but we have at least two sources about that: - Unsurpassed Masters Vol. 6 - Disc 3 - Track # 1 - Keep An Eye On Summer - The Beach Boys Sessions 1964 (Copyright ext. rel.) Track # 22 About Bob, it seems there is a lot of confusion about that, I found a thread on SH board (they started talking about Brian at page two): forums.stevehoffman.tv/threads/ive-about-had-enough-of-bob-norberg.23139/ |
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Post by craigslowinski on Apr 12, 2020 9:44:23 GMT -5
So this other Bob Norberg was engineering Beach Boys sessions at Capitol in '64 and remastering Sinatra and Al Green recordings close to four decades later (and apparently doing a lousy job at it)? I do see a subsequent post on the Hoffman board from 2007 that mentioned he'd recently retired, so if he was close to the Boys' age at the time he worked for them, it would I guess be possible!
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Post by Mikie on Apr 12, 2020 10:23:09 GMT -5
  Left: Bob Norberg from Capitol. Right: Same guy with Brian? Norberg has a lengthy resume at Capitol, mostly remixing. |
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Post by AGD on Apr 12, 2020 11:17:23 GMT -5
Yup, same guy.
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nater
Kahuna
Posts: 210
Likes: 419
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Post by nater on Apr 14, 2020 15:38:57 GMT -5
Did Dean Torrence fill in for Bruce sometime in the early 2000's when Bruce had surgery? Read that years ago on the SS board and am very curious about this...
Do any pictures exist?
Did Dean take any of his leads (I know he sang lead on Sloop with J&D and since, so I can imagine him filling in for Bruce there) or take his spot in the harmony stack? Or was him filling in for credibility?
Did Dean just sing, or play guitar as well?
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Post by Mikie on Apr 14, 2020 19:35:55 GMT -5
When was Row, Row, Row Your Boat with Marilyn and Diane recorded? Assuming sometime in 1966, but the month? November, 1965. |
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Post by Vale on Apr 15, 2020 5:14:14 GMT -5
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Post by AGD on Apr 15, 2020 5:50:11 GMT -5
Given he states the wrong session date for "In My Childhood", I'm prepared to think he's wrong on the date for "RRR" too. The point about it being on the 2016 CopEx release is also valid.
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Post by Mikie on Apr 15, 2020 9:16:34 GMT -5
Philip Lambert's book is one source and another one is:  |
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Post by Mikie on Apr 15, 2020 9:21:48 GMT -5
Salty gets a "Like" for his question but he doesn't give a "Like" for my answer? What, my answers aren't credible? C'mon, man, I don't question your theories about Smile!  |
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Post by AGD on Apr 15, 2020 12:04:29 GMT -5
Sorry, I'd seen the Nov '65 date before and disagree with it! The back of the SoT box lists April 1966 too, which might be more plausible. Both that and the KOMA promo are 8-track which would rule out the 1965 timeframe going on available session dates - there aren't any known visits to Columbia between the Summer Days album and Brian's a capella Don't Talk demo the following year. Alan and Mark must've had access to some information that lead to them putting it on the Graduation Day set.I'm guessing tape box labels. |
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Post by Mikie on Apr 15, 2020 16:48:22 GMT -5
Sorry, I'd seen the Nov '65 date before and disagree with it! The back of the SoT box lists April 1966 too, which might be more plausible. Both that and the KOMA promo are 8-track which would rule out the 1965 timeframe going on available session dates - there aren't any known visits to Columbia between the Summer Days album and Brian's a capella Don't Talk demo the following year. Alan and Mark must've had access to some information that lead to them putting it on the Graduation Day set.I'm guessing tape box labels. Well, I was thinking a tape box label was the source for the date on the SOT boot artwork. The bootlegger obviously didn't pull the 11/65 date out of his butt. And where did author Lambert get the 11/65 date? From the boot or somewhere else? The boot came out in 1998 and Lambert's book was released in 2016, so SOT had that date many years before. |
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Post by Cam Mott on Apr 20, 2020 11:54:49 GMT -5
What are the details on what was recorded at Columbia on March 3, 1967? Documentation and sources please.
Thanks, be safe.
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Post by AGD on Apr 20, 2020 12:24:48 GMT -5
10452 says vocals for "Vega-Tables". Source for that would be Craig's sessionography in The Smile Sessions.
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Post by Cam Mott on Apr 20, 2020 15:35:44 GMT -5
There must have been a tapebox, I wonder it have any notations?
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Post by craigslowinski on Apr 20, 2020 19:51:36 GMT -5
There must have been a tapebox, I wonder it have any notations? There must've been something on a tape box, beyond that I don't know. There are very few references to that date out there and they're all quite vague. Edit: Did find something from an old Smile Shop page. An 8-track comp reel dated to March (no reference to March 3 specifically) apparently contained the original version of Vega-Tables, the 'Ballad Insert' a capella piece, the piano/vocal 'Insert', and the 'Nowhere' version of Child is Father of the Man probably meant for Wonderful. The first VT also appears on another undated 8-track comp that was likely put together in December 1966. Everything else was done over various later dates at Sound Recorders in April. So no actual recording session for any of these in early March. There IS a Sound Recorders 8-track comp reel dated 3/3/67 (originally the month was "2", but then it was changed to "3" by the same hand - pretty typical for early in a new month). However, the track sheet indicates it contains "Tune 'X' By Carl Wilson" and "Ballad Insert for 'Vegetables'". Then, there is another Sound Recorders 8-track comp reel, this one dated 4/12/67 - notations on that one indicate it consists of what are labeled as "BREAK" (with a notation of "Wonderful" next to it), "TUNE X" (with notes next to it of "Don't Use" and under it of "Child Is Father Of The Man" - this is the one slated on the tape as "Nowhere"), and what are obviously several different sections of the April version(s) of "Vegetables": Verses #1, #2 and #3, Last Verse ("Don't Use"), Chorus, and Ending. |
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Post by craigslowinski on Apr 20, 2020 21:22:46 GMT -5
Salty: yep - will dig into when I have the time. This one was an easy grab.
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Post by Cam Mott on Apr 21, 2020 10:22:41 GMT -5
So Carl's March 3 recording at Sound Recorders is apparently the first Brother Records recording and just after the recently filed lawsuit to break their contract with Capitol.
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