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Post by Fall Breaks on Apr 21, 2021 5:37:36 GMT -5
Almost for the minor questions thread, but hey:
Had Mike heard Tony Asher's lyrics when he wrote his lyrics for Good Vibrations? Did he base his opinion on the song needing a girl-boy theme to connect with the audience on hearing the track alone? Because Asher's lyrics are also on the girl-boy theme although a bit trippier.
Also, should Asher have a writing credit on the hit version of the song since "I, I only looked in her eyes" became the similar "When I look in her eyes"? I mean, as per "Lex WIBN", something as little as adding "Good night, baby, sleep tight baby" apparently merits a credit.
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Post by nts1drums on Apr 21, 2021 6:22:43 GMT -5
Almost for the minor questions thread, but hey: Had Mike heard Tony Asher's lyrics when he wrote his lyrics for Good Vibrations? Did he base his opinion on the song needing a girl-boy theme to connect with the audience on hearing the track alone? Because Asher's lyrics are also on the girl-boy theme although a bit trippier. Also, should Asher have a writing credit on the hit version of the song since "I, I only looked in her eyes" became the similar "When I look in her eyes"? I mean, as per "Lex WIBN", something as little as adding "Good night, baby, sleep tight baby" apparently merits a credit. I thought Brian wrote the looking in her eyes part, but I guess not. I’ll have to have another listen. |
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Post by craigslowinski on Apr 21, 2021 7:44:00 GMT -5
According to Mike, he attended one of the early GV instrumental tracking sessions (Chuck Britz also mentioned this), and it was at that session that Mike came up with the hookline lyrics, "I'm picking up good vibrations, SHE'S giving me excitations". According to Mike, that's all he came up with at the time. If this was before Tony's lyrics were written, then Mike indeed originated the whole "boy-girl" theme. Tony then wrote the first draft of verse lyrics, which Brian later asked Mike to replace.
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Post by WillJC on Apr 21, 2021 8:11:48 GMT -5
Well, Mike was in the room if not during then immediately before or after Brian had Carl cut a guide vocal to the Asher lyrics, so it would've been hard for him to avoid them!
Brian only had the "good, good, good, good vibrations" hook at the time he collaborated with Tony, and that's before recording a track. It's also all he had several weeks later. If, somehow, Mike had miraculously managed to not hear the lyrics before the first post-Pet-Sounds session at Western or Brian playing it at his house, then there's a tiny smidgeon of a possibility Mike came up with boy/girl independently.
He had definitely heard Asher's lyrics by the time Brian asked him to write some new verses, because Dennis recorded a vocal.
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Post by Cam Mott on Apr 21, 2021 11:29:28 GMT -5
For what it is worth (if helpful at all) Tony told me that whatever he and Brian had written together for GV was done before any tracking was recorded with the understanding they would get back to it later. Makes sense since most of their collaboration seems to have been in January.
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Post by nts1drums on Apr 21, 2021 11:50:09 GMT -5
I’m pretty sure that Tony was aware of the cover and the song with Sachen.
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Post by Mikie on Apr 21, 2021 11:53:11 GMT -5
Mike may have thought Tony's lyrics weren't good (of course he wouldn't  ) but I've always really liked them, ever since I first heard them aired publicly on the radio special "Beat Summer Of Our Loves" in 1976. According to Mike, his original line was, "she goes with me to a blossom world we find" but Brian cut off the last two words to highlight the bass track linking into the chorus. I never knew this until the 2012 reunion tour, where Jeff Foskett(?) surprisingly sang the line with all the words intact on a couple three concert dates. |
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Post by nts1drums on Apr 21, 2021 11:56:25 GMT -5
Mike may have thought Tony's lyrics weren't good (of course he wouldn't ) but I've always really liked them, ever since I first heard them aired publicly on the radio special "Beat Summer Of Our Loves" in 1976. According to Mike, his original line was, "she goes with me to a blossom world we find" but Brian cut off the last two words to highlight the bass track linking into the chorus. I never knew this until the 2012 reunion tour, where Jeff Foskett(?) surprisingly sang the line with all the words intact on a couple three concert dates. And now they sing "we find" at every show! That kinda defeats the purpose of excluding it. |
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Post by AGD on Apr 21, 2021 14:10:22 GMT -5
Always remember, Tony's lyrics were never intended to be released, or even heard. They were just placeholders.
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Post by Fall Breaks on Apr 21, 2021 14:12:36 GMT -5
Has he commented on how he felt about Capitol releasing them?
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Post by nts1drums on Apr 21, 2021 14:13:46 GMT -5
Always remember, Tony's lyrics were never intended to be released, or even heard. They were just placeholders. Aware of that. As for the addition of the “we find”, I don’t know why they would be included back if the intention was to not use them for the final recording. What would’ve been the point? I think it’s better to leave out those lyrics so that the viewer is left to interpret them by themselves. Adding back “we find” kinda kills that suspense. Now as for Tony’s lyrics, I’m glad they weren’t used on the recording. They’re terrible. |
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Post by #JusticeForDonGoldberg on Apr 21, 2021 14:35:25 GMT -5
Ya, the OG lyrics are garbage.
Although, to this day I’m still fascinated at what the first line of the song was supposed to be
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Post by nts1drums on Apr 21, 2021 15:21:56 GMT -5
Ya, the OG lyrics are garbage. Although, to this day I’m still fascinated at what the first line of the song was supposed to be Since there's footage of Dennis recording them, it would definitely be possible to read his lips and discern the lyric if we were to see all of that footage! !!! Where would one find this footage? 😮 |
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Post by Mikie on Apr 21, 2021 17:41:40 GMT -5
Ya, the OG lyrics are garbage. Not at all. I love 'em. Specially after hearing Brian sing them. Imagine being a fan for six years and hearing only the released version, then being surprised to hear it for the first time. Along with an unreleased instrumental track that nobody else heard before. |
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Post by Cam Mott on Apr 21, 2021 18:17:59 GMT -5
"That's definitely Tony Asher playing the jaw harp at the session that Carl recorded his scratch vocal"
I do have a memory of Asher telling me he played a "jaw" harp (he didn't say "jaw") but I don't remember what song. Is it on any other PS tracks?
On the other hand, I can not find any note of it down in my ol' evidence bunker.
On the third hand, I thought I remember a published account of it since then, along with admitting he didn't really know what the Boys meant by their comments about his lyrics or if they meant anything by them. Can't find those either so they all might only reside together in a cardboard box in the alternate universe of my so-called memory.
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Post by Mikie on Apr 21, 2021 18:22:04 GMT -5
Ya, the OG lyrics are garbage. Yeah, some dumb ass decided to include Tony's GV lyrics on a bonus track on the Smiley Smile/Wild Honey 2-fer. They're so bad that Brian sang the alternate GV with Tony's lyrics for his solo album BWPS and in live Smile concerts for a couple years. Somebody musta liked 'em..... |
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Post by nts1drums on Apr 21, 2021 18:22:16 GMT -5
"That's definitely Tony Asher playing the jaw harp at the session that Carl recorded his scratch vocal" I do have a memory of Asher telling me he played a "jaw" harp (he didn't say "jaw") but I don't remember what song. Is it on any other PS tracks? On the other hand, I can not find any note of it down in my ol' evidence bunker. On the third hand, I thought I remember a published account of it since then, along with admitting he didn't really know what the Boys meant by their comments about his lyrics or if they meant anything by them. Can't find those either so they all might only reside together in a cardboard box in the alternate universe of my so-called memory. Relating to the question about the Jew’s harp on other ps tracks. To my knowledge, aside from the plucked piano strings done with Brian, he doesn’t do anything else on Pet Sounds. There is a jew’s harp on Good Vibrations, but it’s played during the 1st bridge, and from my understanding the session used on the final recording doesn’t mark his presence during this part. I could be wrong but I thought it was Tommy Morgan during this section. |
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Post by Cam Mott on Apr 21, 2021 18:25:21 GMT -5
A "Tony" is called out by name on TSS I remember.
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Post by Mikie on Apr 21, 2021 18:28:07 GMT -5
I do have a memory of Asher telling me he played a "jaw" harp (he didn't say "jaw") but I don't remember what song. Is it on any other PS tracks? Cam, a Jaw Harp (Jew's Harp) is being played on one of the outtake instrumental tracks of Good Vibrations. Listen to the Good Vibrations sessions and you'll hear it. Issat the one you're thinking of? Brian's singing "Good, Good, Good, Good Vibrations yeah! Good, Good, Good, Good Vibrations yeah!" |
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Post by nts1drums on Apr 21, 2021 18:28:50 GMT -5
A "Tony" is called out by name on TSS I remember. During which section? The verse? If so, then I think Terry Melcher is mentioned, although that’s an unsure credit from here. smileysmile.net/board/index.php/topic,24767.msg600676.html#msg600676 |
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Post by Mikie on Apr 21, 2021 18:31:05 GMT -5
"That's definitely Tony Asher playing the jaw harp at the session that Carl recorded his scratch vocal" I do have a memory of Asher telling me he played a "jaw" harp (he didn't say "jaw") but I don't remember what song. Is it on any other PS tracks? On the other hand, I can not find any note of it down in my ol' evidence bunker. On the third hand, I thought I remember a published account of it since then, along with admitting he didn't really know what the Boys meant by their comments about his lyrics or if they meant anything by them. Can't find those either so they all might only reside together in a cardboard box in the alternate universe of my so-called memory. I could be wrong but I thought it was Tommy Morgan during this section. Tommy Morgan played harmonica on Good Vibrations. |
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Post by nts1drums on Apr 21, 2021 18:46:44 GMT -5
Yes that’s true. He also had an overdub for the jew’s harp during the first bridge and that was listed as Tommy Morgan. This is in the link above and most likely is also on the Smile sessionography thing on the smile sessions.
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Post by #JusticeForDonGoldberg on Apr 21, 2021 22:42:36 GMT -5
Ya, the OG lyrics are garbage. Yeah, some dumb ass decided to include Tony's GV lyrics on a bonus track on the Smiley Smile/Wild Honey 2-fer. They're so bad that Brian sang the alternate GV with Tony's lyrics for his solo album BWPS and in live Smile concerts for a couple years. Somebody musta liked 'em..... Indeed they did. Cool to hear for historical value, but Brian was smart enough to not release them on the actual single. |
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Post by Mikie on Apr 21, 2021 22:59:26 GMT -5
Yeah, some dumb ass decided to include Tony's GV lyrics on a bonus track on the Smiley Smile/Wild Honey 2-fer. They're so bad that Brian sang the alternate GV with Tony's lyrics for his solo album BWPS and in live Smile concerts for a couple years. Somebody musta liked 'em..... Indeed they did. Cool to hear for historical value, but Brian was smart enough to not release them on the actual single. I shoulda put one of these at the end of my last post.  Kinda for sarcasm. But.........maybe you're right. I'll give you that. |
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Post by nts1drums on Apr 21, 2021 23:45:05 GMT -5
The jaw harp was added during the same vocal session that Carl recorded Tony's lyrics, and the song was mixed down. The hidden "tape rewind" track on the smile sessions (from that day) is totally Tony Asher's voice. Sounds like he initially was overdubbing while the track was being bounced down (simultaneously to Carl adding a bass part), but then Brian had him lay out and overdub it (+double it) with Carl's vocal. That part is credited to "Tony (last name unknown)" in Craig's sessionography so that just about confirms that it's Asher. A "Tony" also played tambourine on Sloop John B. But the Tony on Sloop wasn’t Asher, because I’m pretty sure when the backing track was being recorded that they hadn’t even met each other. |
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) but I've always really liked them, ever since I first heard them aired publicly on the radio special "Beat Summer Of Our Loves" in 1976.
Kinda for sarcasm. But.........maybe you're right. I'll give you that.