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Post by Deleted on Feb 4, 2019 12:18:40 GMT -5
I am not particularly fond of Brian's recent projects. If he were to write and sing songs using the voice he currently possesses, I'd be down with that.
This is Paolo Conte at around the age Brian is now. Yea, I know, two different voices and energy. Still...
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Post by Deleted on Feb 4, 2019 14:39:30 GMT -5
Overrated. A couple of excellent songs and a bunch of average ones - like most BW solo albums. I don't think Brian's singing on That Lucky Old Sun is as good as Gershwin, Disney, No Pier Pressure, or parts of TWGMTR. Ya know Sheriff, I usually disagree with you on just about everything on here, Smiley and PS forums, but you nailed it here. Though I think That Lucky Old Sun is a quirky, cool little album with a few good songs, I don't think it is as crazy awesome as a lot on the boards think.And yeah, I don't think his vocals on it are that awesome. I honestly prefer No Pier Pressure and I think his vocals on that and the latest Beach Boys album were the best I've heard from him since like Sunflower. Who are you...or who were you?
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Post by Paul JB on Feb 4, 2019 14:58:27 GMT -5
I think No Pier Pressure is Brian's best solo album (as I enter the basement fallout shelter). After hearing him sing with that damaged voice in the 1970's and 1980's, and at his advanced age, I never thought he'd be able to sing at the level he did on No Pier Pressure. Its not my favorite, but probably top three, behind TLOS and WIRWFC. Mentioned this before but since it keeps coming up, me too Sheriff. I think it's as good a record as Brian has been capable of for a long, long time. It's, got Al, Blondie, a few really good songs, two women I'm now a fan of (Zooey & Kacey....saw Kacey live last year and she's great) and the auto tune is actually minimal by today's standards. Plus once again........cover art that looks great in vinyl (record) size!
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Post by Autotune on Feb 4, 2019 15:15:27 GMT -5
Whatever you say about the production merit (or lack of thereof) of NPP, songwriting-wise it has to be Brian’s most unexciting and boring work to date. Even at his worst, Brian’s songwriting has a compelling element; in this case, the chord progressions are pedestrian, and there are no quirks or memorable songs. That’s why I think this the album he was least involved with in terms of composition.
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Post by nogosherbet on Feb 4, 2019 16:23:23 GMT -5
I'd actually enjoy a solo piano & vocal album from Brian, even with his current voice and playing ability. He could do new songs, or old songs, or covers. Whatever he feels like. It wouldn't necessarily be a "good" album, but that's beside the point. This would be more like a gift to his fans. The man himself, singing to us, exactly as he is.
Actually, what I'd like even more is something like a mix of Smiley Smile, Lei'd in Hawaii, and Elvis's Jungle Room sessions. If I were in charge, here's what I do: set up an inpromptu studio in Brian's house, in the room where his piano is. Make the recording equipment as un-intrusive as possible. Invite the other Beach Boys and maybe a few friends. Al and Dave could bring acoustic guitars. I'd encourage them to just play for fun and not to worry about getting everything perfect. Do only a few takes per song with minimal overdubbing. There'd be no autotune or pitch correction or anything like that. No attempt to pretend these guys aren't in their 70s. If Mike and Brian end up writing something new, great, but there wouldn't be any pressure to do that.
Basically, I'd try and create a situation that's as close as we can get in 2019 to how the Beach Boys started: friends and family playing and singing together at home.
Oh, and go find Brian's old Baldwin organ, or have someone make a replica. Brian actually does say in his book that he'd like to use it again.
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Post by Autotune on Feb 4, 2019 21:35:34 GMT -5
I'd actually enjoy a solo piano & vocal album from Brian, even with his current voice and playing ability. He could do new songs, or old songs, or covers. Whatever he feels like. It wouldn't necessarily be a "good" album, but that's beside the point. This would be more like a gift to his fans. The man himself, singing to us, exactly as he is.
Actually, what I'd like even more is something like a mix of Smiley Smile, Lei'd in Hawaii, and Elvis's Jungle Room sessions. If I were in charge, here's what I do: set up an inpromptu studio in Brian's house, in the room where his piano is. Make the recording equipment as un-intrusive as possible. Invite the other Beach Boys and maybe a few friends. Al and Dave could bring acoustic guitars. I'd encourage them to just play for fun and not to worry about getting everything perfect. Do only a few takes per song with minimal overdubbing. There'd be no autotune or pitch correction or anything like that. No attempt to pretend these guys aren't in their 70s. If Mike and Brian end up writing something new, great, but there wouldn't be any pressure to do that.
Basically, I'd try and create a situation that's as close as we can get in 2019 to how the Beach Boys started: friends and family playing and singing together at home.
Oh, and go find Brian's old Baldwin organ, or have someone make a replica. Brian actually does say in his book that he'd like to use it again.
I’d love that. I don’t think it’s releasable, though.
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dutchie
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Post by dutchie on Feb 5, 2019 12:24:13 GMT -5
i hope he can put one out.
I think there are enough songs left and maybe a album with Al would be great.
A last BB album in the future .... lets hope.... one can right?
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Post by E on Feb 5, 2019 13:05:20 GMT -5
Even at his worst, Brian’s songwriting has a compelling element; in this case, the chord progressions are pedestrian, and there are no quirks or memorable songs. Tend to agree.
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Post by mikedonn on Feb 5, 2019 13:40:52 GMT -5
Whatever you say about the production merit (or lack of thereof) of NPP, songwriting-wise it has to be Brian’s most unexciting and boring work to date. Even at his worst, Brian’s songwriting has a compelling element; in this case, the chord progressions are pedestrian, and there are no quirks or memorable songs. That’s why I think this the album he was least involved with in terms of composition. It sounds like the same description I'd attach to most of That Lucky Old Sun! I really enjoy NPP. I listen to more of that than TLOS.
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Post by AGD on Feb 5, 2019 14:00:09 GMT -5
Whatever you say about the production merit (or lack of thereof) of NPP, songwriting-wise it has to be Brian’s most unexciting and boring work to date. Even at his worst, Brian’s songwriting has a compelling element; in this case, the chord progressions are pedestrian, and there are no quirks or memorable songs. That’s why I think this the album he was least involved with in terms of composition. It sounds like the same description I'd attach to most of That Lucky Old Sun!I really enjoy NPP. I listen to more of that than TLOS. With all due respect, that's so close to being complete nonsense as makes no difference: TLOS originated out of the 2006 Bennet home studio demo sessions, which Brian was very much engaged in, so much so that several of those demo vocals were used in the final product, most notably on the sublime "Midnight's Another Day".
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Post by The Cap'n on Feb 5, 2019 17:15:35 GMT -5
I'd actually enjoy a solo piano & vocal album from Brian, even with his current voice and playing ability. He could do new songs, or old songs, or covers. Whatever he feels like. It wouldn't necessarily be a "good" album, but that's beside the point. This would be more like a gift to his fans. The man himself, singing to us, exactly as he is.
Actually, what I'd like even more is something like a mix of Smiley Smile, Lei'd in Hawaii, and Elvis's Jungle Room sessions. If I were in charge, here's what I do: set up an inpromptu studio in Brian's house, in the room where his piano is. Make the recording equipment as un-intrusive as possible. Invite the other Beach Boys and maybe a few friends. Al and Dave could bring acoustic guitars. I'd encourage them to just play for fun and not to worry about getting everything perfect. Do only a few takes per song with minimal overdubbing. There'd be no autotune or pitch correction or anything like that. No attempt to pretend these guys aren't in their 70s. If Mike and Brian end up writing something new, great, but there wouldn't be any pressure to do that.
Basically, I'd try and create a situation that's as close as we can get in 2019 to how the Beach Boys started: friends and family playing and singing together at home.
Oh, and go find Brian's old Baldwin organ, or have someone make a replica. Brian actually does say in his book that he'd like to use it again.
You're welcome to your opinion, but I have to say that I'm glad this is so unlikely to happen, because I think it would be just about the worst possible outcome (other than maybe some kind of collaboration with a hot young producer trying to incorporate faddish modern pop or something). For me, the value of this band was primarily in their ability to execute amazing vocal arrangements over great songs. Their voices are diminished to the poing that casual takes are likely to be bad. Their instrumental abilities weren't great to begin with (Dave notwithstanding). I know some people value nostalgia more than I do, but a back-to-basics instrumental arrangement with poor singing over the top isn't my idea of a good time.
The "no pressure" approach, I do like. I've said for probably 20 years now that my dream would be for a semi-inspired Brian to do quick-and-dirty recordings of whatever he had in mind, whenever he had them in mind, and releasing them online immediately. He has always wanted immediate feedback, and he has gotten bored with projects over the past few decades very quickly.
But that's also just a pipe dream, just like the Beach Boys "unplugged" kind of sessions you describe. There is no way someone with that legacy is going to agree to just put out apparently unfinished material on a whim. I don't think he or his team have the guts for that. I think the best hope for actually listenable product is more of the NPP approach (though I know some don't consider that listenable) of cowriting, coproducing, with lots of help on vocals.
The best or most interesting Brian Wilson music we're going to get that we haven't heard before is most likely the stuff that's released after he dies, not anything newly recorded.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 5, 2019 17:22:47 GMT -5
I have a feeling some of Brian’s best solo material is still in the vault. Some of my favorites of his solo career were left off albums and/or rarely played live (e.g., Being with the one you love, this song wants to sleep with you, summertime). Would love to hear outtakes from his albums someday.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 5, 2019 18:35:35 GMT -5
I don't know who wrote what or how much of the songs on No Pier Pressure, but I would put "This Beautiful Day", "Whatever Happened", "Our Special Love", "The Right Time", "Don't Worry", "Somewhere Quiet", "Tell Me Why", "Sail Away", "One Kind Of Love", and yes, "Saturday Night" up against ANY group of songs on any Brian Wilson solo album.
And the same goes for Brian's vocals. As I'm typing this I'm listening to "Whatever Happened" and Our Special Love". Those are damned good vocals, very emotional, and that's not a given for Brian's solo career vocals. I'll say it again and I don't care, but Joe Thomas does a helluva job in bringing out the best in Brian's vocals. On some of those No Pier Pressure vocals, I can almost imagine how Brian would've sounded at age 70-something if he wouldn't have destroyed his voice in 1974-75.
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Post by jay on Feb 6, 2019 4:50:07 GMT -5
I'll probably get crucified for this, but I'll say it anyway. I think any new music and/ or album from Brian now would have the best chance of working if Scott Bennet were involved. But we all know why this can't and won't happen.
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Post by kds on Feb 6, 2019 8:17:58 GMT -5
I don't know who wrote what or how much of the songs on No Pier Pressure, but I would put "This Beautiful Day", "Whatever Happened", "Our Special Love", "The Right Time", "Don't Worry", "Somewhere Quiet", "Tell Me Why", "Sail Away", "One Kind Of Love", and yes, "Saturday Night" up against ANY group of songs on any Brian Wilson solo album.
And the same goes for Brian's vocals. As I'm typing this I'm listening to "Whatever Happened" and Our Special Love". Those are damned good vocals, very emotional, and that's not a given for Brian's solo career vocals. I'll say it again and I don't care, but Joe Thomas does a helluva job in bringing out the best in Brian's vocals. On some of those No Pier Pressure vocals, I can almost imagine how Brian would've sounded at age 70-something if he wouldn't have destroyed his voice in 1974-75.
I have to agree with you here about NPP, as well as the previous two Brian / Thomas albums - Imagination and TWGMTR (BB). Say what you want about the glossy production, but Joe Thomas has IMHO gotten a lot of good songs out of Brian Wilson in the last two decades. At this late stage in his career, I'm not expecting mind blowing arrangements like the 60s, and I can't say I'm disappointed in the lack of quirkiness in Brian's recent solo offerings. But, to get well sung songs with very good, pleasant melodies is a positive in my book.
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Post by filledeplage on Feb 6, 2019 10:10:49 GMT -5
I'll probably get crucified for this, but I'll say it anyway. I think any new music and/ or album from Brian now would have the best chance of working if Scott Bennet were involved. But we all know why this can't and won't happen. No - you should not get crucified. Bennett committed a crime, was convicted, did his time, and should be re-integrated. That is the point of incarnation and probation/ parole; to rehabilitate a person who committed a crime to be re-integrated into society. That is the justice system. Maybe he got substance/alcohol abuse treatment. Maybe he got other therapy. He is a musician/songwriter. I am not of the mind that wrongdoing excludes a person from re-joining society for the rest of your life. [Look at Bill Clinton. A sitting president whose poll numbers rose after the scandal with Monica broke.] Is there forgiveness after rehabilitation? All things being equal - I would prefer Brian work with his original band. It makes sense to me because whatever he writes seems to be in that BB member voice construction - with other voices (who are great vocalists in their own right) and not the originals. But that is not my choice.
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Post by The Cap'n on Feb 6, 2019 13:07:40 GMT -5
Brian Wilson is an indie-type artist trying to fit into a major label role and has been since the late sixties or maybe mid-seventies. So he needs these filters --namely the adult contempo filter to make "major label" music. And I think that is a bit of a tragedy. I think that’s one of the biggest misconceptions about BW Omer the past 25 years. I’ll write why later, likely tonight. (At work now, can’t get detailed.) I don’t think it’s entirely unconvincing and I think it’s quite appealing...but I think it’s mostly wrong.
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Post by Mikie on Feb 6, 2019 13:28:45 GMT -5
I'll probably get crucified for this, but I'll say it anyway. I think any new music and/ or album from Brian now would have the best chance of working if Scott Bennet were involved. But we all know why this can't and won't happen. No - you should not get crucified. Bennett committed a crime, was convicted, did his time, and should be re-integrated. That is the point of incarnation and probation/ parole; to rehabilitate a person who committed a crime to be re-integrated into society. That is the justice system. Maybe he got substance/alcohol abuse treatment. Maybe he got other therapy. He is a musician/songwriter. I am not of the mind that wrongdoing excludes a person from re-joining society for the rest of your life. Agreed.
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Post by filledeplage on Feb 6, 2019 14:17:32 GMT -5
No - you should not get crucified. Bennett committed a crime, was convicted, did his time, and should be re-integrated. That is the point of incarnation and probation/ parole; to rehabilitate a person who committed a crime to be re-integrated into society. That is the justice system. Maybe he got substance/alcohol abuse treatment. Maybe he got other therapy. He is a musician/songwriter. I am not of the mind that wrongdoing excludes a person from re-joining society for the rest of your life. [Look at Bill Clinton. A sitting president whose poll numbers rose after the scandal with Monica broke.] Is there forgiveness after rehabilitation? Considering the crime in question and the fact that it was only a few years ago this post is pretty disgusting Shocking and personally revolting as one might find it - this is what the American Legal system is all about. Incarceration is supposed to be two-pronged. One, as punishment and two, as a deterrent to others - it says, "Don't do this - or you are going to jail." . Parole/probation is to re-integrate the person back into society while someone in the legal system monitors what that person, an employer, a half-way house manager, a substance abuse counselor and any/all medical people involved to document changes in attitude, drug/alcohol testing results, etc. And, I did not post it to disgust posters, or condone what happened, but to explain how the system works.
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Post by The Cap'n on Feb 6, 2019 19:25:23 GMT -5
Brian Wilson is an indie-type artist trying to fit into a major label role and has been since the late sixties or maybe mid-seventies. So he needs these filters --namely the adult contempo filter to make "major label" music. And I think that is a bit of a tragedy. I think that’s one of the biggest misconceptions about BW Omer the past 25 years. I’ll write why later, likely tonight. (At work now, can’t get detailed.) I don’t think it’s entirely unconvincing and I think it’s quite appealing...but I think it’s mostly wrong. First of all, the fact that my phone autocorrected "over" into "Omer" means I've undoubtedly mentioned Turkish basketball player Omer Asik too much. I have a problem. A real problem.
More on point, I guess my quibble depends on what you mean by "indie-type artist." If you mean a respected niche artist who isn't going to sell many records, then yes, I guess that's not far off. (Though that's not what I'd call "indie," it is true that these guys often end up on semi-indie imprints of the majors.)
But if you mean that he's someone just trying to do his own thing on his own terms and doesn't want to coexist with major labels, I think that's wrong. I think that especially from the 90s onward, when a number of then-hip indies were fawning publicly over BW (and especially his less commercial music), that became a popular idea. And stories contrasting meetings with Joe Thomas and Sean O'Hagan help reinforce that, with the "former pro wrestler-cum-AC country musician" shitting on the idea of BW as an avante garde genius, etc.
Emo kids, indie kids, outsiders found something to love in BW and claimed him as their own, but I think they're making him their ventriloquist dummy, to be honest. What they love is in there, sure ... but so are pop hits. Lots and lots of pop hits. And realistically, his influences are more straight than hip, whether Gershwin or Four Freshmen or Chuck Berry or Rosemary Clooney. He has always--ALWAYS--talked about wanting to have hits and make money. (He may not have been good with money, but that's another matter altogether.) He has always expressed disappointment at the lack of commercial success of some of his work.
I believe the idea that if left to his own devices, Wilson would run amok in some home studio with strange and wonderful music is just a fantasy, the same kind of thing that fans of surf music probably have that he'd be doing that.
Speculation, yes. But that's my speculation.
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Post by Autotune on Feb 6, 2019 21:12:46 GMT -5
I think that’s one of the biggest misconceptions about BW Omer the past 25 years. I’ll write why later, likely tonight. (At work now, can’t get detailed.) I don’t think it’s entirely unconvincing and I think it’s quite appealing...but I think it’s mostly wrong. First of all, the fact that my phone autocorrected "over" into "Omer" means I've undoubtedly mentioned Turkish basketball player Omer Asik too much. I have a problem. A real problem.
More on point, I guess my quibble depends on what you mean by "indie-type artist." If you mean a respected niche artist who isn't going to sell many records, then yes, I guess that's not far off. (Though that's not what I'd call "indie," it is true that these guys often end up on semi-indie imprints of the majors.)
But if you mean that he's someone just trying to do his own thing on his own terms and doesn't want to coexist with major labels, I think that's wrong. I think that especially from the 90s onward, when a number of then-hip indies were fawning publicly over BW (and especially his less commercial music), that became a popular idea. And stories contrasting meetings with Joe Thomas and Sean O'Hagan help reinforce that, with the "former pro wrestler-cum-AC country musician" shitting on the idea of BW as an avante garde genius, etc.
Emo kids, indie kids, outsiders found something to love in BW and claimed him as their own, but I think they're making him their ventriloquist dummy, to be honest. What they love is in there, sure ... but so are pop hits. Lots and lots of pop hits. And realistically, his influences are more straight than hip, whether Gershwin or Four Freshmen or Chuck Berry or Rosemary Clooney. He has always--ALWAYS--talked about wanting to have hits and make money. (He may not have been good with money, but that's another matter altogether.) He has always expressed disappointment at the lack of commercial success of some of his work.
I believe the idea that if left to his own devices, Wilson would run amok in some home studio with strange and wonderful music is just a fantasy, the same kind of thing that fans of surf music probably have that he'd be doing that.
Speculation, yes. But that's my speculation.
Agree wholeheartedly. O’Hagan’s argument with Thomas about Brian being an avant-garde artist comes to mind. Thomas was right— perhaps for the wrong reasons, but right anyway. Nevertheless, Brian is a difiicult act to sell these days(that is to market, or to project to a specific niche), specially as a solo artist, and that very difficulty influences the music that comes out. For instance, this idea that a BW album must have a suite of songs, or a concept, or a continuity, is a constructed one, I think.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 6, 2019 21:35:16 GMT -5
Considering the crime in question and the fact that it was only a few years ago this post is pretty disgusting Shocking and personally revolting as one might find it - this is what the American Legal system is all about. Incarceration is supposed to be two-pronged. One, as punishment and two, as a deterrent to others - it says, "Don't do this - or you are going to jail." . Parole/probation is to re-integrate the person back into society while someone in the legal system monitors what that person, an employer, a half-way house manager, a substance abuse counselor and any/all medical people involved to document changes in attitude, drug/alcohol testing results, etc. And, I did not post it to disgust posters, or condone what happened, but to explain how the system works. I doubt Brian and his team would ever want him back again, but I totally agree with what you're saying - he should be given a chance to get back to society at some point, no matter how severe his crime was (unless he had been sentenced to death/lifetime in prison.) One could legitimately argue that his punishment was not proportional with what he had done, but he was released as a matter of fact and he should be given support to assimilate into society without committing any crime ever again.
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Post by kds on Feb 6, 2019 22:02:24 GMT -5
I think that’s one of the biggest misconceptions about BW Omer the past 25 years. I’ll write why later, likely tonight. (At work now, can’t get detailed.) I don’t think it’s entirely unconvincing and I think it’s quite appealing...but I think it’s mostly wrong. First of all, the fact that my phone autocorrected "over" into "Omer" means I've undoubtedly mentioned Turkish basketball player Omer Asik too much. I have a problem. A real problem.
More on point, I guess my quibble depends on what you mean by "indie-type artist." If you mean a respected niche artist who isn't going to sell many records, then yes, I guess that's not far off. (Though that's not what I'd call "indie," it is true that these guys often end up on semi-indie imprints of the majors.)
But if you mean that he's someone just trying to do his own thing on his own terms and doesn't want to coexist with major labels, I think that's wrong. I think that especially from the 90s onward, when a number of then-hip indies were fawning publicly over BW (and especially his less commercial music), that became a popular idea. And stories contrasting meetings with Joe Thomas and Sean O'Hagan help reinforce that, with the "former pro wrestler-cum-AC country musician" shitting on the idea of BW as an avante garde genius, etc.
Emo kids, indie kids, outsiders found something to love in BW and claimed him as their own, but I think they're making him their ventriloquist dummy, to be honest. What they love is in there, sure ... but so are pop hits. Lots and lots of pop hits. And realistically, his influences are more straight than hip, whether Gershwin or Four Freshmen or Chuck Berry or Rosemary Clooney. He has always--ALWAYS--talked about wanting to have hits and make money. (He may not have been good with money, but that's another matter altogether.) He has always expressed disappointment at the lack of commercial success of some of his work.
I believe the idea that if left to his own devices, Wilson would run amok in some home studio with strange and wonderful music is just a fantasy, the same kind of thing that fans of surf music probably have that he'd be doing that.
Speculation, yes. But that's my speculation.
I tend to agree here, and never really got where the avant garde / indie stuff comes from with Brian. Maybe its Smile, or the myth of Smile. Or maybe a lot of indie / hip music fans discovering Pet Sounds in the 90s who can proudly attend a BW show without that "uncool Kokomo guy with the ballcap from Full House" to ruin things. But, there's little to nothing in the past 40 years that would lead me to call Brian indie.
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Post by filledeplage on Feb 6, 2019 22:21:06 GMT -5
Shocking and personally revolting as one might find it - this is what the American Legal system is all about. Incarceration is supposed to be two-pronged. One, as punishment and two, as a deterrent to others - it says, "Don't do this - or you are going to jail." . Parole/probation is to re-integrate the person back into society while someone in the legal system monitors what that person, an employer, a half-way house manager, a substance abuse counselor and any/all medical people involved to document changes in attitude, drug/alcohol testing results, etc. And, I did not post it to disgust posters, or condone what happened, but to explain how the system works. I doubt Brian and his team would ever want him back again, but I totally agree with what you're saying - he should be given a chance to get back to society at some point, no matter how severe his crime was (unless he had been sentenced to death/lifetime in prison.) One could legitimately argue that his punishment was not proportional with what he had done, but he was released as a matter of fact and he should be given support to assimilate into society without committing any crime ever again. Wata - each state has its own sentencing guidelines. For that state, there might be other factors, such as a "first offender," or "good behavior," or weight put on the probation and therapy end. We don't know all the facts. It was not I who mentioned that Brian worked well with Scott B. His talent did not evaporate while incarcerated. That is the point - being re-assimilated back into society. He has children - so he must be highly motivated to be in therapy, and fulfill other criteria. I only wish him well - for himself and his family as well as the woman who was assaulted.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 6, 2019 22:21:53 GMT -5
First of all, the fact that my phone autocorrected "over" into "Omer" means I've undoubtedly mentioned Turkish basketball player Omer Asik too much. I have a problem. A real problem. More on point, I guess my quibble depends on what you mean by "indie-type artist." If you mean a respected niche artist who isn't going to sell many records, then yes, I guess that's not far off. (Though that's not what I'd call "indie," it is true that these guys often end up on semi-indie imprints of the majors.)
But if you mean that he's someone just trying to do his own thing on his own terms and doesn't want to coexist with major labels, I think that's wrong. I think that especially from the 90s onward, when a number of then-hip indies were fawning publicly over BW (and especially his less commercial music), that became a popular idea. And stories contrasting meetings with Joe Thomas and Sean O'Hagan help reinforce that, with the "former pro wrestler-cum-AC country musician" shitting on the idea of BW as an avante garde genius, etc.
Emo kids, indie kids, outsiders found something to love in BW and claimed him as their own, but I think they're making him their ventriloquist dummy, to be honest. What they love is in there, sure ... but so are pop hits. Lots and lots of pop hits. And realistically, his influences are more straight than hip, whether Gershwin or Four Freshmen or Chuck Berry or Rosemary Clooney. He has always--ALWAYS--talked about wanting to have hits and make money. (He may not have been good with money, but that's another matter altogether.) He has always expressed disappointment at the lack of commercial success of some of his work. I believe the idea that if left to his own devices, Wilson would run amok in some home studio with strange and wonderful music is just a fantasy, the same kind of thing that fans of surf music probably have that he'd be doing that.
Speculation, yes. But that's my speculation.
I tend to agree here, and never really got where the avant garde / indie stuff comes from with Brian. Maybe its Smile, or the myth of Smile. Or maybe a lot of indie / hip music fans discovering Pet Sounds in the 90s who can proudly attend a BW show without that "uncool Kokomo guy with the ballcap from Full House" to ruin things. But, there's little to nothing in the past 40 years that would lead me to call Brian indie. Perhaps Smiley Smile & Love You (and Surfin' Safari) were the only cases he could be considered doing indie music. Other than that, I can't think of Brian putting out indie-ish music officially. (I think there's a lot of such stuff left in the vaults, though)
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