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Post by Stephen W. Desper on Feb 25, 2020 18:00:28 GMT -5
COMMENT to Petsite:
Some threads ago a topic was started by Petsite. Somewhere in the discussion someone ask about the sections in the song as it was released on "Surf's Up," the album, where Brian sings and plays the piano. When Carl came to the studio on that day with an armful of tape boxes it started a laborious and detailed resurrection and reconstruction with it's genesis routed in Brian's performance on a 1966 CBS special of Leonard Bernstein lecturing about Rock Music at that time.
I came across that TV show while surfing the Internet and thought those of you who are interested in the sonic history of what Carl and the Beach Boys had to work with to create the sound you hear on the final release. Brian had done the part presented at the link(s) below in, shall we say, a basic foundation. Upon that the rest was built and/or extrapolated. Brian, at that time was critically depressed, so what you hear on these link(s) and some other performances and rehearsals of the song, together with much editing and vocal sweetening makes up what you hear on the released version.
I'm certain some of you are familiar with these links, but for those who are not, it's of historical note . . .
BRIAN SECTION ONLY >>>
ENTIRE SHOW "Inside Pop: The Rock Revolution" (Brian at end) >>>
~swd
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Post by John Manning on Feb 25, 2020 19:10:22 GMT -5
Many thanks for that, Mr Desper.
If memory serves me right, from what I’ve read in various books, this version was recorded and double tracked by Brian immediately after the film crew had left:
Were you involved in recording this? I’ve always assumed (dangerous, I know!) that the second half of this recording of the song (after the two intro verses) was used when creating the (definitive, in my mind) 1971 version?
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Post by John Manning on Feb 25, 2020 19:18:48 GMT -5
And I’d love to know whether this session for the first section is what produced the instrumental track used in the 1971 version; or was this either augmented or even re-recorded for that release?
Many thanks in advance!
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petsite
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Post by petsite on Feb 25, 2020 21:02:52 GMT -5
Thank you Mr. Desper. You keep pulling rabbits out of a hat for us crazies here on this board. So great to have these videos! The Brian SURF'S UP vocal and piano track was indeed recorded at CBS Studios on December 15, 1966. CBS News filmed the session on which Brian played piano and double tracked his vocal. I don't know if he sang one of the overdubs while playing the piano, but, I am guessing no because listening to just the piano track, there is no vocal bleed over. I would guess the top to the grand piano would be opened and mic'ed that way, so you would pick up Brian singing. This is just my guess. The version of Brian singing from the CBS special was filmed at his house on the 17th. It seems Brian was not satified with his performance at CBS two nights before. Who knows why.  |
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Post by Stephen W. Desper on Feb 25, 2020 21:44:24 GMT -5
And I’d love to know whether this session for the first section is what produced the instrumental track used in the 1971 version; or was this either augmented or even re-recorded for that release? Many thanks in advance!
As far as Brian doubling after the broadcast, yes, but the tape was in terrible shape. It looked like someone had stepped on it -- parts of the tape were crinkled and would not pass over the tape heads without dropouts. Those sections had to be ducked and Carl sang the dropped parts -- or filled in the missing parts. There was also a rehearsal tape used for some damaged parts that I edited into the mix. With proper or mimicked pronunciation and added EQ Carl can sound quite simulator to his brother. So using all these techniques, the final "solo" parts sounds reasonably good. It was assumed that the "solo" parts were actually meant to have tracking under them, but since only part of the track for the song was recorded, Carl decided to keep Brian's singing with piano as it was, and not add instruments -- only creating vocals for those parts of the song that had been tracked. The Moog bass was added as a segue joining the solo and tracked parts so as to flow one into the other, rather than just a blunt splice.
During the time we worked on the song, sometimes Carl would figure out an approach, then go upstairs and confer with Brian in his bedroom. Then come back to the studio and continue. All in all, the vibs were rather intense.
As to the Smile production, I know nothing. ~swd |
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Post by Stephen W. Desper on Feb 25, 2020 21:51:49 GMT -5
COMMENT to petsite: This is where you fans know more about it than I do. This box could have been one of several that we transferred to the 16-track to work on. Carl arrived with a stack of them and had an idea of what he wanted to do, but as I said, some of the tracks were damaged -- and so we had to deal with that unfortunate situation. The eventual solo track was, a collection of several tapes and sweetenings as it had to meet the standards required of an LP release. ~swd
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petsite
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Post by petsite on Feb 25, 2020 22:03:59 GMT -5
Stephen, I can not thank you enough for all of this information. You know how fans know a lot? Because people like you who were there are generous enough to take the time and tell us what happened. I have a massive amount of posts from you and others that I have backed and that I read through time and again. Thanks for doing this!
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Post by Stephen W. Desper on Feb 25, 2020 22:27:45 GMT -5
COMMENT: I see the tape you showed was recorded at Columbia. That was a union studio, so I doubt Chuck Britz would not have engineered that session. Brian was often frustrated by that place and RCA, and one of the reasons, so-called, independent studios became so popular. The engineers wore white lab coats and followed union rules to the letter. Brian tells of being in the middle of a track or even near the end of a track with the studio full of players, when the second hand of the clock pointed to 12 exactly -- and down would come the master knob, and the tape would stop. It may have been a perfect take, but these engineers were unforgiving. They were not interested in the music -- especially rock music -- as union breaks were strictly enforced. The hell with the recording.
I remember one session (by the way I was a union member) at Columbia in which I had taken the output of one limiter and inputted it into another, thus over-driving the second limiter to create a guitar distortion, unlike you get from a guitar headamp. All of a sudden in walks the head of the technical department, takes one look at my patch and yanks out the patch -- right in mid-recording. I ask, what are you doing? To which I was lectured, we don't do things like that here. We use the equipment as it was designed to be used! And that ended that sound. Of course, the equipment was not being hurt, except in principle.
Columbia was built for classical or big-band sessions. Lots of polycylindrical defusers, giving the studio a live sound without much separation. And the patch bay was extensive, but not user friendly. It was designed to do everything in a standard way. Using it for "creative patching" was a nightmare.
Columbia was a great studio and many of my prized recordings are on the Columbia label. But, working there was not a pleasure. ~swd
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petsite
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Post by petsite on Feb 25, 2020 23:32:33 GMT -5
Stephen,
Columbia sounds like Abbey Road back in the 60s. Lab coats etc. The studios shut down at midnight.
Once, when Pink Floyd was working, Norman Smith, the Beatles engineer for their all of there LPs up until Rubber Soul, was the producer for the Floyd session. In walks the head of the studio to tell Smith to shut it down as it was after midnight. Smith refused, saying the Beatles didn't have to shut down, why should he? The head of the studio did not argue, he just walked around to the back of the building and pulled the main circuit breaker for the entire building, got into his car and went home, telling the guard at the gate to get everyone out of the building and to NOT turn the power back on.
That is craziness defined there!
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Post by John Manning on Feb 26, 2020 3:21:04 GMT -5
COMMENT to John Manning: The track was previously recorded by Brian… … ~swd Many thanks for that Stephen, really appreciated – helps build up a far better mental picture of the entire process.
As for the events at Columbia, that's gobsmacking. Tantamount to sabotage! Imagine someone blowing the candle out on Van Gogh…
PETSITE: so Brian performing at the piano was filmed twice, on the 15th and 17th? That had never sunk in before, many thanks. But aftre the crew's departure from his house, Brian re-recorded himself at the house, audio only? Or am I conflating various sources of info and memory?
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petsite
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Post by petsite on Feb 26, 2020 3:29:09 GMT -5
Brian was recorded at COLUMBIA by CBS. Read Jules Segal's GOODBYE SURFING HELLO GOD article for the story. He was then filmed 2 nights later at house singing SU again. I think both Brian and David wanted a more subdued setting for Brian to sing in. At COLUMBIA, it was cutting the piano track, vocal 1 and vocal 2. At his house it was a performance. I don't think Brian recorded himself at his home, just at COLUMBIA.
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Post by John Manning on Feb 26, 2020 3:30:58 GMT -5
Many thanks Petsite, appreciate the clarity. I think I'd misunderstood the sequence of events in Segal… will revisit that!
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Post by Stephen W. Desper on Feb 26, 2020 10:31:12 GMT -5
COMMENT to John Manning: Whatever the "sequence of events" all the results arrived at the house studio to be picked apart, taking the best parts, the undamaged parts, and sweetened by Carl's voice to become one coherent performance. Surf's Up had previously been aired by CBS. The record company had already advanced royalty money to the group. Mo Austin was exerting a lot of pressure for an acceptable LP with Surf's Up on it. Brian detached himself from further involvement with the song. All we had were the Lenard Bernstein tapes and some partial tracking sessions. Out of this pile of tapes, Carl and the guys had to complete what Brian had abandon.
Of course, the talent I worked with was extreme. But the role of the engineer in this particular song should not be underplayed as is depicted in this little skit . . . 
~swd
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Post by craigslowinski on Feb 26, 2020 11:45:02 GMT -5
COMMENT to John Manning: Whatever the "sequence of events" all the results arrived at the house studio to be picked apart, taking the best parts, the undamaged parts, and sweetened by Carl's voice to become one coherent performance. Surf's Up had previously been aired by CBS. The record company had already advanced royalty money to the group. Mo Austin was exerting a lot of pressure for an acceptable LP with Surf's Up on it. Brian detached himself from further involvement with the song. All we had were the Lenard Bernstein tapes and some partial tracking sessions. Out of this pile of tapes, Carl and the guys had to complete what Brian had abandon.
Of course, the talent I worked with was extreme. But the role of the engineer in this particular song should not be underplayed as is depicted in this little skit . . .
~swd That is hysterical! Thanks for that! |
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Post by Stephen W. Desper on Feb 26, 2020 13:40:26 GMT -5
To clear up the Smile timeline, here's how it went down: On 11/4, Brian recorded the backing track for the first section of the song at Western, and on 11/7 added some horn overdubs. That's disc 3, track 18 on the smile sessions box set. On 12/15, Brian recorded a piano track of the entire song and then overdubbed a double-tracked vocal at Columbia, with the Inside Pop crew filming. Two days later, on 12/17, they film Brian at his house, performing live for the cameras. The studio footage from 12/15 wasn't used and is now lost. The 11/4 track for the "first movement" was used as the basis for half of the 1971 version, and Brian's solo recording on 12/15 was used for the second half.
Thinking of this process as if a journey up a stairway, ascending one step after the other is not the way to picture it. it's more like an escalator ride, in which the steps blend or commingle to form one continuous and uninterrupted journey.
I appreciate your effort to show where to find some of the elements used, but the process of conjoining them is fluent, not fragmented. ~swd |
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Post by Stephen W. Desper on Feb 26, 2020 15:21:39 GMT -5
COMMENT: Surf's Up is not the only time the tape has been damaged. However, in the case of Surf's Up, it could be rescued with an overdub.
Listen to Good Vibrations, at the start "... and the way the sunlight plays upon her hair." You will hear the top end of the organ drop out during the sighted lyrics, in fact it pops in and out right between the two splice points.
What happened? During editing, sometimes a small section of tape needs to be placed aside while another section is spliced. Rather than spool it onto a reel, engineers will let the tape fall to the floor as it spools from the capstan. It may be only a few feet of tape. it stays on the floor until the supply reel is mounted, then the splice is made and the tape is wound back onto the reel. But in the case of Good Vibs', while on the floor it got stepped on and thus wrinkled. Putting it back together, now when the wrinkled part passes over the playback head some parts of the tape surface are lifted from the head gap and thus loose signal. You will hear the organ drop down in level at "and the way..." and emerge twice in less than a second after "... her hair."
Now that I've forever spoiled hearing Good Vibs' for you, at least you'll know why.
Someone named Billy Bloomer posted these interesting statistics:
4 studios, 20 sessions, 90+ hours of recording tape, over a dozen instruments, rigid touring schedules, session musicians, key changes, tempo changes, five-part vocal harmonies, 7 sections and a $75,000 budget.
All crammed into 3 and a half minutes. Bravo guys.
~swd
Good Vibs' >>>
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Post by Joshilyn Hoisington on Feb 26, 2020 15:48:24 GMT -5
COMMENT: I see the tape you showed was recorded at Columbia. That was a union studio, so I doubt Chuck Britz would not have engineered that session. Brian was often frustrated by that place and RCA, and one of the reasons, so-called, independent studios became so popular. The engineers wore white lab coats and followed union rules to the letter. Brian tells of being in the middle of a track or even near the end of a track with the studio full of players, when the second hand of the clock pointed to 12 exactly -- and down would come the master knob, and the tape would stop. It may have been a perfect take, but these engineers were unforgiving. They were not interested in the music -- especially rock music -- as union breaks were strictly enforced. The hell with the recording.
I remember one session (by the way I was a union member) at Columbia in which I had taken the output of one limiter and inputted it into another, thus over-driving the second limiter to create a guitar distortion, unlike you get from a guitar headamp. All of a sudden in walks the head of the technical department, takes one look at my patch and yanks out the patch -- right in mid-recording. I ask, what are you doing? To which I was lectured, we don't do things like that here. We use the equipment as it was designed to be used! And that ended that sound. Of course, the equipment was not being hurt, except in principle.
Columbia was built for classical or big-band sessions. Lots of polycylindrical defusers, giving the studio a live sound without much separation. And the patch bay was extensive, but not user friendly. It was designed to do everything in a standard way. Using it for "creative patching" was a nightmare.
Columbia was a great studio and many of my prized recordings are on the Columbia label. But, working there was not a pleasure. ~swd Here's some photos of the Columbia studio's control room:   Here's a great shot of that ample patch bay:  Another one with the gang:  And here's one with who I think we all believe is Ralph Valentin (mercifully freed of a lab coat) directing Brian:  If that is Ralph, or, whoever it might be, regardless, he appears in the GV sessions film that appeared a few years ago, in an even more profound state of undress. Incidentally, it is fun to compare contemporaneous photos of Columbia Hollywood with Columbia's various NYC studios--lots of uniformity there. |
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Post by Stephen W. Desper on Feb 26, 2020 16:51:36 GMT -5
COMMENT to aeijtzsche: Great photos! I remember you're a big fan of vintage equipment. You can see the infamous clock on the wall right between the monitors in full view. I note that in your photos, only the engineer is touching the knobs. Isn't Columbia the studio where the story goes that Brian reached out to move a knob and the engineer slapped his hand away? In your last photo, Brian is looking so fondly at that one knob. I can "hear" him thinking, man, if I could just move that knob we could get things done a lot faster around here. ~swd
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Post by Stephen W. Desper on Feb 26, 2020 17:32:26 GMT -5
COMMENT to aeijtzsche: In thinking about it, it maybe I'm remembering white lab coats worn by the Lab Techs, i.e., the fellows that kept everything working, but not recording engineers. Even at Capital, there were some people in lab coats.
You all should know that in aeijtzsche's equipment photos, everything is operating using vacuum tubes, oil filled capacitors, carbon resistors, and wired with cotton wrapped -- wax impregnated wire. The console is crammed with vacuum tubes. All of it required so much maintenance that a staff of repair specialists were employed to service everything. They operated a separate shop filled with test equipment just for that purpose. Down time is money lost, especially if something breaks down during a session with the studio full of musicians -- paid whether the tape is rolling or not. So I may be remembering the Laboratory Technicians. ~swd
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petsite
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Post by petsite on Feb 26, 2020 17:48:12 GMT -5
COMMENT to aeijtzsche: In thinking about it, it maybe I'm remembering white lab coats worn by the Lab Techs, i.e., the fellows that kept everything working, but not recording engineers. Even at Capital, there were some people in lab coats.
You all should know that in aeijtzsche's equipment photos, everything is filled with vacuum tubes, oil filled capacitors, carbon resistors, and wired with cotton wrapped -- wax impregnated wire. The console is filled with vacuum tubes. All of it required so much maintenance that a staff of repair specialists were employed to service everything. They operated a separate shop filled with test equipment just for that purpose. Down time is money lost, especially if something breaks down during a session with the studio full of musicians -- paid whether the tape is rolling or not. So I may be remembering the Laboratory Technicians. ~swd Stephen, Mark Linnet has a great story about owning one of the consoles from WESTERN from back in the day. He was so proud of it. When a former WESTERN engineer stopped by Mark's studio. Mark shows him his new prize.....and the engineer is like why do you have that POS. We had to replaces tubes etc in that thing. One man's trash is another's treasure. |
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Post by Joshilyn Hoisington on Feb 26, 2020 17:53:43 GMT -5
COMMENT to aeijtzsche: In thinking about it, it maybe I'm remembering white lab coats worn by the Lab Techs, i.e., the fellows that kept everything working, but not recording engineers. Even at Capital, there were some people in lab coats.
You all should know that in aeijtzsche's equipment photos, everything is filled with vacuum tubes, oil filled capacitors, carbon resistors, and wired with cotton wrapped -- wax impregnated wire. The console is filled with vacuum tubes. All of it required so much maintenance that a staff of repair specialists were employed to service everything. They operated a separate shop filled with test equipment just for that purpose. Down time is money lost, especially if something breaks down during a session with the studio full of musicians -- paid whether the tape is rolling or not. So I may be remembering the Laboratory Technicians. ~swd Stephen, Mark Linnet has a great story about owning one of the consoles from WESTERN from back in the day. He was so proud of it. When a former WESTERN engineer stopped by Mark's studio. Mark shows him his new prize.....and the engineer is like why do you have that POS. We had to replaces tubes etc in that thing. One man's trash is another's treasure. I think that is really the crux of the whole vintage v. not vintage dynamic; all that those of us who record and engineer records want is for the final product to sound great. In the 60s, that meant all that stuff that Steve described--there was no alternative. Now we have lots more options at a much lower cost and with much fewer maintenance issues. Ultimately, that's a good thing, even if there is something lost in the encoding of the sound. And of course, it's much easier to think one knows what they're doing when they actually don't... |
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petsite
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Post by petsite on Feb 26, 2020 18:00:02 GMT -5
Stephen, Mark Linnet has a great story about owning one of the consoles from WESTERN from back in the day. He was so proud of it. When a former WESTERN engineer stopped by Mark's studio. Mark shows him his new prize.....and the engineer is like why do you have that POS. We had to replaces tubes etc in that thing. One man's trash is another's treasure. I think that is really the crux of the whole vintage v. not vintage dynamic; all that those of us who record and engineer records want is for the final product to sound great. In the 60s, that meant all that stuff that Steve described--there was no alternative. Now we have lots more options at a much lower cost and with much fewer maintenance issues. Ultimately, that's a good thing, even if there is something lost in the encoding of the sound. And of course, it's much easier to think one knows what they're doing when they actually don't... Oh that last line hits home! |
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Post by Cam Mott on Feb 26, 2020 19:20:25 GMT -5
In 2 of those photos Brian looks he is positioning his hand to sneak a tweak of a knob if he gets a shot.
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Post by Joshilyn Hoisington on Feb 26, 2020 20:06:36 GMT -5
In 2 of those photos Brian looks he is positioning his hand to sneak a tweak of a knob if he gets a shot. Well, I have no doubt he operated the board at CBS. There's film of him doing it. |
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Post by Joshilyn Hoisington on Feb 26, 2020 20:12:00 GMT -5
To wit (3:14 if it doesn't auto skip there for ya):
Note also that it's a different engineer to the photos? IDs, anybody?
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