felipe
Grommet
Posts: 14
Likes: 5
|
Post by felipe on Mar 30, 2024 16:57:21 GMT -5
Cool. I thought no one knew that recording date and implied it was from those early Heroes and Villains full-lenght lost sessions. I was based on Brian's tendency of stripping down the arrangements as months passed. So I'm Great Shape started as a standalone track with at least three parts (verse/IWBA/Friday Night), was later rerecorded and incorporated into Heroes and Villains, replaced by Cantina and desappeared from the project?
|
|
|
Post by AGD on Mar 31, 2024 6:04:36 GMT -5
Musicians as per the 11/29/66 AFM contract: Bill Pitman, leader: guitar & vibes Diane Rovell: contractor Gene Estes: vibes & percussion Jim Gordon: drums & "board drop" Carol Kaye: guitar Larry Levine, engineer: ? Lyle Ritz: standup bass and drill
The session lasted from 2pm to 6pm. According to a 1966 Teen Set article, David Oppenheim also contributed sound effects, "tools in hand, banging and sawing away".
|
|
|
Post by advancecharmander on Mar 31, 2024 19:02:35 GMT -5
The contract for November 29 states the title of the recorded piece as "FRIDAY NIGHT (I'm in great shape)". I have a scan. There were two sections recorded that day - I Wanna Be Around, and the original fadeout piece referred to as "Friday Night" at the session (later re-titled "Workshop" on official releases decades later). Both were spliced together at the end of the session. The version of Great Shape with the strings on the 2018 release is not an early version; it's a "late" version from December 1966. It postdates the Great Shape track and vocal demo on the Smile Sessions box set (October 1966), and I Wanna Be Around / Friday Night (November 1966). It comes from a longer Heroes And Villains edit that exists only in the hands of the collector who has the acetate disc. Yeah, I wish we had the full acetate, the little snippet we have is real neat. Though I never thought that Workshop was supposed to be the fade-out, since most fanmixes (including my own) just let it run the whole way through.
|
|
sloopjohnb
Historian / Researcher
Posts: 252
Likes: 401
|
Post by sloopjohnb on Apr 1, 2024 15:30:04 GMT -5
Friday Night was definitely recorded as a fade (Brian makes that clear during the session), and the actual recording runs a lot longer than the Smile Sessions edit.
Yes, the 11/29 AFM contract does say "I'm in great shape" as a subtitle, but that title is not mentioned at any point during the session, and is not written on the tape box track sheet or spine. The melody we know as "I'm In Great Shape" also has nothing to do with the music recorded that date. Brian himself was not actually the one physically writing out all the documentation we rely on in the AFM contracts, tape boxes, and Capitol worksheets, and there are many many instances of mismatched titles for these sessions. He was also notorious in this era for not communicating his plans, and changing them around like crazy. I think it's very likely that the person who typewrote the union contract (Diane Rovell probably?) just wrote out the wrong Smile title that starts with "I". It was a bigger priority to ensure that the musicians' payments were logged correctly. "FRIDAY NIGHT (I wanna be around)" makes more sense to me.
As for the real I'm In Great Shape - the piece was part of Heroes and Villains on at least November 4 (the Humble Harv demo) and December 19 (the edit on the Durrie Parks acetate). Probably October 27 as well, and everywhere in between. The only documentation that suggests it as a separate song from Heroes And Villains is the handwritten track list (which is probably from around mid October). Who knows what THAT version sounded like in Brian's head, if it wasn't just a title idea at the time.
|
|
felipe
Grommet
Posts: 14
Likes: 5
|
Post by felipe on Apr 9, 2024 0:31:14 GMT -5
Any chance that tracklist being by Brian?
|
|
sloopjohnb
Historian / Researcher
Posts: 252
Likes: 401
|
Post by sloopjohnb on Apr 9, 2024 11:00:56 GMT -5
Physically, no, it was written by someone else. Nearly every document from this era was dictated by Brian, but printed by someone else's hand.
|
|
|
Post by Cam Mott on Apr 9, 2024 18:57:48 GMT -5
My understanding is neither Capitol Production or the Art Director would act on any list, let alone order 400,000 copies, that was not from or approved by the Producer, which was Brian.
Is it any different today?
That understanding came from the late George Osaki, Capitol Art Director for the SMiLE album.
|
|
Tilt Araiza
Dude/Dudette
Dominated Ruins Columbo
Posts: 64
Likes: 85
|
Post by Tilt Araiza on Apr 10, 2024 22:35:28 GMT -5
Was that the guy who decided on the logo on the cover saying "SMiLE"?
|
|
|
Post by Mikie on Apr 11, 2024 0:04:37 GMT -5
Was that the guy who decided on the logo on the cover saying "SMiLE"? The bold handwritten red and blue text ("Smile The Beach Boys") above the store front was done by the Capitol Records art department. The rest was done by Frank Holmes. Note that the words "Good Vibrations" x3 were not included with Frank's original SMiLE cover artwork submission and was presumably added by the Capitol art department.
|
|
|
Post by AGD on Apr 11, 2024 5:10:10 GMT -5
Physically, no, it was written by someone else. Nearly every document from this era was dictated by Brian, but printed by someone else's hand. In this instance, Diane Rovell.
|
|
|
Post by Cam Mott on Apr 11, 2024 6:50:25 GMT -5
George Osaki remembered the album (from images I sent him) but did not remember who did the lettering, except that he didn't do it.
It was probably one of Capitol's designers, like Rod Dyer or Roy Kohara, and/or production artists, like maybe Gil Reyes, Milt Newman, or Helene Jacobs. I talked with Rod Dyer and he didn't seem to remember doing the lettering either however.
|
|
Tilt Araiza
Dude/Dudette
Dominated Ruins Columbo
Posts: 64
Likes: 85
|
Post by Tilt Araiza on Apr 12, 2024 20:04:01 GMT -5
Was that the guy who decided on the logo on the cover saying "SMiLE"? The bold handwritten red and blue text ("Smile The Beach Boys") above the store front was done by the Capitol Records art department. The rest was done by Frank Holmes. Note that the words "Good Vibrations" x3 were not included with Frank's original SMiLE cover artwork submission and was presumably added by the Capitol art department. I just knew Cam had asked someone close to the source specifically about that.
|
|
|
Post by highllama on Apr 13, 2024 2:20:53 GMT -5
The only documentation that suggests it as a separate song from Heroes And Villains is the handwritten track list (which is probably from around mid October). Hey, sloopjohnb, I had a question about the October date. Where does that come from? I'm not saying you're wrong, I just always thought the tracklist was from December. I'm curious about the timeline. I remember Peter Reum, almost 20 years ago, discussing a 12/7 or 12/8 meeting with the band which turned Smile from Brian's symphony into a 12-track pop album. Perhaps wrongly, I thought the tracklist was a result of that. His comments were controversial at the time, though I don't see a good reason not to believe them. They certainly help to explain some Smile details, rather than contradict them.
|
|
|
Post by WillJC on Apr 13, 2024 9:06:57 GMT -5
The only documentation that suggests it as a separate song from Heroes And Villains is the handwritten track list (which is probably from around mid October). Hey, sloopjohnb, I had a question about the October date. Where does that come from? I'm not saying you're wrong, I just always thought the tracklist was from December. I'm curious about the timeline. I remember Peter Reum, almost 20 years ago, discussing a 12/7 or 12/8 meeting with the band which turned Smile from Brian's symphony into a 12-track pop album. Perhaps wrongly, I thought the tracklist was a result of that. His comments were controversial at the time, though I don't see a good reason not to believe them. They certainly help to explain some Smile details, rather than contradict them. The December estimate comes from a completed copy of the back cover stamped received by Ray Polley of Capitol on Dec 6, which was followed by some amendments to the design dated Dec 10. However, that was a then-finalised version, and a memo indicates it was in progress at Capitol recieving some changes (unrelated to the songs) by mid-November. There isn't a date on the handwritten list itself or evidence of when it was delivered to the label, but ultimately it doesn't correspond to what was recorded past a certain point, and Brian clearly wasn't following the titles as gospel later regardless of how far the sleeves had gotten into production. By Oct 20, Heroes and Villains did not have a bridge section, and 'I'm in Great Shape' existed independently as a title. On Oct 27 Great Shape was recorded as Heroes' bridge, where it remained as that part of the song until late December. Brian didn't record a straight cover of The Old Master Painter, as he may have once been planning, he instead recorded a new creation that came about spontaneously titled 'My Only Sunshine', which is consistently called that in every place a title was written down from 1966 to 1968. So, sometime shortly before Oct 27 would probably be when the list had to be drawn up. Those claims from Peter Reum about Smile aren't credible.
|
|
|
Post by Cam Mott on Apr 13, 2024 11:16:27 GMT -5
That would fit with Vosse's claim that the album was fully conceptualized (or whatever) by time the Boys left for Europe/UK.
And also supported, to a degree, by the ever developing evidence that BW and VDP had the bulk of the writing of the songs they wrote completed in short order (think BW and Tony Asher) Save possibly some bits and bobs and revisions of H&V etc. IMO.
I guess later, things changed.
|
|
|
Post by highllama on Apr 13, 2024 12:23:41 GMT -5
Hey, sloopjohnb, I had a question about the October date. Where does that come from? I'm not saying you're wrong, I just always thought the tracklist was from December. I'm curious about the timeline. I remember Peter Reum, almost 20 years ago, discussing a 12/7 or 12/8 meeting with the band which turned Smile from Brian's symphony into a 12-track pop album. Perhaps wrongly, I thought the tracklist was a result of that. His comments were controversial at the time, though I don't see a good reason not to believe them. They certainly help to explain some Smile details, rather than contradict them. The December estimate comes from a completed copy of the back cover stamped received by Ray Polley of Capitol on Dec 6, which was followed by some amendments to the design dated Dec 10. However, that was a then-finalised version, and a memo indicates it was in progress at Capitol recieving some changes (unrelated to the songs) by mid-November. There isn't a date on the handwritten list itself or evidence of when it was delivered to the label, but ultimately it doesn't correspond to what was recorded past a certain point, and Brian clearly wasn't following the titles as gospel later regardless of how far the sleeves had gotten into production. By Oct 20, Heroes and Villains did not have a bridge section, and 'I'm in Great Shape' existed independently as a title. On Oct 27 Great Shape was recorded as Heroes' bridge, where it remained as that part of the song until late December. Brian didn't record a straight cover of The Old Master Painter, as he may have once been planning, he instead recorded a new creation that came about spontaneously titled 'My Only Sunshine', which is consistently called that in every place a title was written down from 1966 to 1968. So, sometime shortly before Oct 27 would probably be when the list had to be drawn up. Those claims from Peter Reum about Smile aren't credible. Thank you, Will!
|
|
felipe
Grommet
Posts: 14
Likes: 5
|
Post by felipe on Apr 14, 2024 23:37:06 GMT -5
Came across this old thread describing Inside Pop reels 83 1. engineer 2. pan up to Brian 3. board 4. Boys singing who Ran The Iron Horse (Above "who Ran" is the scratched out word "Hooray" as if he wasn't sure what the words were.) 5. Wilson ? (judging, foda?!?!) 6. Boys singing who Ran The Iron Horse 7. Do Wa Wa in circle 8. Wilson (shelving?!) 84 9. Let's work on microphone boys around mike Do wa 85 Brian at piano working out(?) Yodelledo then group sings at mike 86 Group around mike Yodelledo Playback Yodelledoo's control in b.g. Inside control room Group & Engineer Da daum(?) (La daum?) Go out into studio Brian eating cereal record da da da da 86 1. around mike Yodeladeeo pan to Piano Brian walks out frame(?) to outside booth playback walks to control board 2. Brian talking ?? (bad pa toheps) to engineer 3. dark 4/s listening to playback Brian goes to ?? (sirke?!) eats, put on headphones sing dine dine Scratch 87 1. control board thru window track on(?) dine dine Let's go have some Zen accompaniment 2. Brian at piano from behind plays chords 87 engineer thru glass to group in(?) b.g. record da da group comes back into room & listens to da da da let's go lets have some zen compliment Brian at piano from behind accomp. to Surf's up to hands to face CL around to x & back to CL I left in bold what probably is the "vocal session that had gone very badly" described by Jules Siegel as having been filmed before the recording of Surf's Up demo. For years I had hopes it could be some Surf's Up background vocals attempts, but what came before suggests Wonderful or Cabin Essence... what do you guys think?
|
|
|
Post by Cam Mott on Apr 15, 2024 6:20:09 GMT -5
Dan Lega, on this board, could tell us the tale of turning this archive.
|
|
|
Post by AGD on Apr 15, 2024 13:51:46 GMT -5
Came across this old thread describing Inside Pop reels 83 1. engineer 2. pan up to Brian 3. board 4. Boys singing who Ran The Iron Horse (Above "who Ran" is the scratched out word "Hooray" as if he wasn't sure what the words were.) 5. Wilson ? (judging, foda?!?!) 6. Boys singing who Ran The Iron Horse 7. Do Wa Wa in circle 8. Wilson (shelving?!) 84 9. Let's work on microphone boys around mike Do wa 85 Brian at piano working out(?) Yodelledo then group sings at mike 86 Group around mike Yodelledo Playback Yodelledoo's control in b.g. Inside control room Group & Engineer Da daum(?) (La daum?) Go out into studio Brian eating cereal record da da da da 86 1. around mike Yodeladeeo pan to Piano Brian walks out frame(?) to outside booth playback walks to control board 2. Brian talking ?? (bad pa toheps) to engineer 3. dark 4/s listening to playback Brian goes to ?? (sirke?!) eats, put on headphones sing dine dine Scratch 87 1. control board thru window track on(?) dine dine Let's go have some Zen accompaniment 2. Brian at piano from behind plays chords 87 engineer thru glass to group in(?) b.g. record da da group comes back into room & listens to da da da let's go lets have some zen compliment Brian at piano from behind accomp. to Surf's up to hands to face CL around to x & back to CL I left in bold what probably is the "vocal session that had gone very badly" described by Jules Siegel as having been filmed before the recording of Surf's Up demo. For years I had hopes it could be some Surf's Up background vocals attempts, but what came before suggests Wonderful or Cabin Essence... what do you guys think? The date for this session as filmed by Oppenheim is December 15th, and the songs worked on were: You're Welcome "Ball And Mitt" (or probably not...)
Cabin Essence Wonderful Surf's Up (Brian solo)
|
|
danlega
Grommet
Posts: 14
Likes: 32
|
Post by danlega on Apr 15, 2024 21:04:54 GMT -5
If this was the session Jules Siegel describes as going very badly, then perhaps my guesses as to the written words in a couple places were correct, i.e. "judging" and "shelving" in the Cabinessence session. Perhaps Brian didn't think the background vocal session was going well? And I don't think there'd be many people who believe the Yodelay-hehoo's on Wonderful were the optimum choice for that song. Perhaps Brian felt that, too, after trying it? Ah... those films and sound tapes from that time! Still the holiest of Holy Grails in the Beach Boys cannon. Would that they still exist and could be found.
|
|
felipe
Grommet
Posts: 14
Likes: 5
|
Post by felipe on Apr 16, 2024 1:12:07 GMT -5
Apparently "yodelay-hehoo" was already recorded and the frustrating session was Mike and Al's "da da da" duet. Brian disliked something to the point of rerecording the whole song 3 weeks later.
|
|
|
Post by WillJC on Apr 16, 2024 6:15:55 GMT -5
If this was the session Jules Siegel describes as going very badly, then perhaps my guesses as to the written words in a couple places were correct, i.e. "judging" and "shelving" in the Cabinessence session. Perhaps Brian didn't think the background vocal session was going well? And I don't think there'd be many people who believe the Yodelay-hehoo's on Wonderful were the optimum choice for that song. Perhaps Brian felt that, too, after trying it? Ah... those films and sound tapes from that time! Still the holiest of Holy Grails in the Beach Boys cannon. Would that they still exist and could be found. Hey Dan, were you able to get scans or photos of these back when you transcribed them? I've long been curious about some of those uncertain words.
|
|
danlega
Grommet
Posts: 14
Likes: 32
|
Post by danlega on Apr 16, 2024 22:45:02 GMT -5
Yes, but I don't have access to them now as they are still in boxes from when I moved. (And hopefully that box wasn't one of the ones that were lost during the move!)
But I was thinking the same thing. If I could post the photocopies I have of those someone else might be able to decipher the handwriting better than I was able to at the time.
If I run across them at some point I'll take photos and upload them.
|
|
|
Post by WillJC on Apr 17, 2024 10:08:25 GMT -5
Yes, but I don't have access to them now as they are still in boxes from when I moved. (And hopefully that box wasn't one of the ones that were lost during the move!) But I was thinking the same thing. If I could post the photocopies I have of those someone else might be able to decipher the handwriting better than I was able to at the time. If I run across them at some point I'll take photos and upload them. Please do when you're able to!
|
|
|
Post by Micha on Apr 18, 2024 2:32:58 GMT -5
Was there ever a picture of the session log that said Workshop was a part of "I'm In Great Shape" or am I just misremembering? Ik this little fact has been spread around but it would be nice to make sure it's true. Here is the actual session log of Workshop, photo taken just before it was drilled into.
|
|