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Post by John Manning on Sept 17, 2023 3:49:54 GMT -5
Forbes: Might there be a future collaboration with the group’s surviving co-founders Brian Wilson and Al Jardine (Dennis Wilson died in 1983. Carl Wilson died in 1998.)? Mike: “There is a documentary coming out on the Beach Boys. I don't know when it's set to air. But we're definitely getting together for that. And that will be pretty nice because, you know, my cousin Brian and I go back to childhood and young adulthood— teenage years and everything. So, he went to high school with Alan Jardine.” www.forbes.com/sites/nancyberk/2023/09/15/mike-love-shares-beatles-inspiration-and-why-the-beach-boys-are-going-country
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Post by AGD on Sept 17, 2023 4:35:01 GMT -5
That's pure BB logic there: Brian and Alan went to school together so they're going to collaborate in the future. No arguing with that...
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Post by John Manning on Sept 17, 2023 4:41:50 GMT -5
That's pure BB logic there: Brian and Alan went to school together so they're going to collaborate in the future. No arguing with that... It IS a very odd non-sequitur. The journalist and/or sub should probably have trimmed that line out. Suspect Mike’s quote amounts to nothing more than them all attending the premiere together … those who are still fit enough to travel.
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Post by ian on Sept 17, 2023 9:17:09 GMT -5
As we’ve all said at times….after the other documentaries…..this will probably be pointless (meaning more talking heads waxing lyrical about Brian’s genius and the aging BBs repeating the same tropes they’ve offered ad nauseam in past interviews)..What would be fascinating would be a deep dive that dares to get into the real story (Mike and Brian’s relationship, Blondie and Ricky and how they fitted/didn’t fit in the group, Mike and Dennis, the decision to become an oldies act, the tension in the 1990s, etc). But that would require these guys to really reckon with their past and I don’t think they want to stir the pot at this point. The other interesting route would be to scour the tv/film vaults from around the world and find whatever footage survives that has not been seen on YouTube or past docs. I doubt however that either scenario will happen.
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Post by newbbfan on Sept 17, 2023 10:50:23 GMT -5
Each of the beach boy has a unique rhetorical style of creating mystical ambiguity and deflecting questions , and no journalists ever say, may I please ask you to be more precise about that and tell us exactly what you mean? No one does they just nod and say cool and write it down.
And I don't see anything here that clarifies what Al is said to have said about getting together at Paradise Cove in service of the documentary, actually to perform.
And reference to Ian's concerns about the potential vacuous nature of the documentary, I thought we did discuss a bit above that the filmmakers here are far far better than that at least as evidenced in their work on Elvis? That documentary is called the searcher, and is not the same filmmakers who are doing this beach boy documentary? Pardon me if I missed a beat or I'm confusing prior information.
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Post by ian on Sept 17, 2023 11:29:44 GMT -5
Yes…but prior to The Searcher…there really wasn’t a serious Elvis documentary and that is not the case with the BBs. Alan B already did a great service with Endless Harmony so the question becomes will this be different really??
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Post by filledeplage on Sept 17, 2023 12:28:40 GMT -5
As we’ve all said at times….after the other documentaries…..this will probably be pointless (meaning more talking heads waxing lyrical about Brian’s genius and the aging BBs repeating the same tropes they’ve offered ad nauseam in past interviews)..What would be fascinating would be a deep dive that dares to get into the real story (Mike and Brian’s relationship, Blondie and Ricky and how they fitted/didn’t fit in the group, Mike and Dennis, the decision to become an oldies act, the tension in the 1990s, etc). But that would require these guys to really reckon with their past and I don’t think they want to stir the pot at this point. The other interesting route would be to scour the tv/film vaults from around the world and find whatever footage survives that has not been seen on YouTube or past docs. I doubt however that either scenario will happen. On the "oldies act" Endless Summer/Spirit of America would probably have taken that decision out of their hands and control. That happy surprise would have shown them the direction to go in, with the monstrous sales on a widespread scale. That was coupled with the end of the Vietnam War. The public spoke and the sales numbers spoke. At that point a lot of bands from the 60s fell into an abyss. Touring saved them and seemed to become their work model. That mega compilation releases and success would generally be where the set lists would come from by necessity, from public demand sprinkled with newer work. After spinning their wheels following the big blackballing post Pet Sounds/Smile, the sheer power of those greatest hit released tracks, set the table. On the synergy between Mike and Brian - that needs to be inferred. Or, can be inferred. That kind of youthful voltage does not come out of thin air. They both came from musical families. You'd hope a very sensitive interviewer could elicit som of that, but the collaboration speaks for itself. I don't need (nor want) an invasive deep dive into what makes them tick. Scouring the TV vaults is probably a good place to go, provided that the footage is there.
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Post by lonelysummer on Sept 17, 2023 14:39:02 GMT -5
As we’ve all said at times….after the other documentaries…..this will probably be pointless (meaning more talking heads waxing lyrical about Brian’s genius and the aging BBs repeating the same tropes they’ve offered ad nauseam in past interviews)..What would be fascinating would be a deep dive that dares to get into the real story (Mike and Brian’s relationship, Blondie and Ricky and how they fitted/didn’t fit in the group, Mike and Dennis, the decision to become an oldies act, the tension in the 1990s, etc). But that would require these guys to really reckon with their past and I don’t think they want to stir the pot at this point. The other interesting route would be to scour the tv/film vaults from around the world and find whatever footage survives that has not been seen on YouTube or past docs. I doubt however that either scenario will happen. On the "oldies act" Endless Summer/Spirit of America would probably have taken that decision out of their hands and control. That happy surprise would have shown them the direction to go in, with the monstrous sales on a widespread scale. That was coupled with the end of the Vietnam War. The public spoke and the sales numbers spoke. At that point a lot of bands from the 60s fell into an abyss. Touring saved them and seemed to become their work model. That mega compilation releases and success would generally be where the set lists would come from by necessity, from public demand sprinkled with newer work. After spinning their wheels following the big blackballing post Pet Sounds/Smile, the sheer power of those greatest hit released tracks, set the table. On the synergy between Mike and Brian - that needs to be inferred. Or, can be inferred. That kind of youthful voltage does not come out of thin air. They both came from musical families. You'd hope a very sensitive interviewer could elicit som of that, but the collaboration speaks for itself. I don't need (nor want) an invasive deep dive into what makes them tick. Scouring the TV vaults is probably a good place to go, provided that the footage is there. I don't think there was really a "decision" to become an oldies act. Yes, ES/SOA decided that for them. How do you ignore two top ten albums? They didn't have any new material out in 74/75 (excepting Child of Winter...BTW, what was the B side? Let me guess...Susie Cincinnati). The new material from 76-80 was featured in the shows. Even when Carl went solo, then returned to the band, they did a few songs from his solo albums. The majority of the setlists, though, obviously, was those big hits from 1962-66. Can't ignore those. The early 70's was a strange time for a lot of "heritage" acts. Paul McCartney with a new band that doesn't play ANY new songs. 50's guys like Rick Nelson and Dion trying to make it as contemporary artists, focusing mostly on their new material. George Harrison on his Dark Hoarse Tour, avoiding (mostly) Beatles songs. That would all change in a few years. Even Harrison, the one time he toured in later years, in Japan, did a show that was mostly the songs he wrote for the Beatles. Even Brian Wilson himself eventually became an oldies artist.
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Post by drbeachboy (Dirk) on Sept 17, 2023 14:52:28 GMT -5
When Dennis went to see Jim Guercio and later hired him to manage the band, the first thing that was done was to embrace their past and fill the set list with the hits. So yes, there was a deliberate decision to move towards the oldies.
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Post by AGD on Sept 17, 2023 14:56:46 GMT -5
When Dennis went to see Jim Guercio and later hired him to manage the band, the first thing that was done was to embrace their past and fill the set list with the hits. So yes, there was a deliberate decision to move towards the oldies. And despite the percieved wisdom, it wasn't Mike's idea. Not that you'll convince a single neo-Brianista, but that's exactly how it happened.
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Post by bessieboporbach on Sept 17, 2023 15:25:06 GMT -5
When Dennis went to see Jim Guercio and later hired him to manage the band, the first thing that was done was to embrace their past and fill the set list with the hits. So yes, there was a deliberate decision to move towards the oldies. And despite the percieved wisdom, it wasn't Mike's idea. Not that you'll convince a single neo-Brianista, but that's exactly how it happened. I'm almost positive that there was a published account of someone going out driving with Dennis in the late '70s, and apparently all he would ever play on the stereo was surf & car-era Beach Boys.
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Post by boogieboarder on Sept 18, 2023 9:03:00 GMT -5
Long before the “Endless Summer” compilation was released, and the so-called switch to oldies, The Beach Boys released their 1973 The Beach Boys in Concert LP, which by my count already contains pretty much all the oldies they are accused of embracing later, including:
Sloop John B California Girls Caroline No Darlin’ Heroes and Villains Help Me Rhonda Surfer Girl Wouldn’t It Be Nice You Still Believe in Me Don't Worry Baby Surfin’ U.S.A. Good Vibrations Fun Fun Fun
With only 4 out of the 20 songs being from their last 2 albums plus one new song, and nothing from the previous four albums, Friends, 20/20, Sunflower, or Surf’s Up - I don’t really see much difference between this album and post-Endless Summer in their live shows.
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Post by bessieboporbach on Sept 18, 2023 9:59:35 GMT -5
Long before the “Endless Summer” compilation was released, and the so-called switch to oldies, The Beach Boys released their 1973 The Beach Boys in Concert LP, which by my count already contains pretty much all the oldies they are accused of embracing later, including: Sloop John B California Girls Caroline No Darlin’ Heroes and Villains Help Me Rhonda Surfer Girl Wouldn’t It Be Nice You Still Believe in Me Don't Worry Baby Surfin’ U.S.A. Good Vibrations Fun Fun Fun With only 4 out of the 20 songs being from their last 2 albums plus one new song, and nothing from the previous four albums, Friends, 20/20, Sunflower, or Surf’s Up - I don’t really see much difference between this album and post-Endless Summer in their live shows. I think it's interesting that Mike can be heard making light of how old some of the songs are on both this record and even the Live in London album (where I believe he uses the phrase "oldies but moldies") as early as 1968. There seems to have been a feeling that performing a fair number of these songs was obligatory well before Endless Summer. 50% of the tracks on Live in London are also present on In Concert from 4 years later. That being said, I think it's worth noting that the Pet Sounds songs on In Concert could be considered promoting a current release, due to how Carl & The Passions was sold. Endless Summer stopped at Summer Days, and In Concert only includes 6 songs from that era, so there definitely was some degree of change. It may just be semantics as to how we define "oldies" in that era, but I do think that, in the aftermath of Endless Summer, a difference in status emerged between the pre- Pet Sounds material and the Pet Sounds-and-after material.
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Post by filledeplage on Sept 18, 2023 10:05:28 GMT -5
Long before the “Endless Summer” compilation was released, and the so-called switch to oldies, The Beach Boys released their 1973 The Beach Boys in Concert LP, which by my count already contains pretty much all the oldies they are accused of embracing later, including: Sloop John B California Girls Caroline No Darlin’ Heroes and Villains Help Me Rhonda Surfer Girl Wouldn’t It Be Nice You Still Believe in Me Don't Worry Baby Surfin’ U.S.A. Good Vibrations Fun Fun Fun With only 4 out of the 20 songs being from their last 2 albums plus one new song, and nothing from the previous four albums, Friends, 20/20, Sunflower, or Surf’s Up - I don’t really see much difference between this album and post-Endless Summer in their live shows. I think it's interesting that Mike can be heard making light of how old some of the songs are on both this record and even the Live in London album (where I believe he uses the phrase "oldies but moldies") as early as 1968. There seems to have been a feeling that performing a fair number of these songs was obligatory well before Endless Summer. 50% of the tracks on Live in London are also present on In Concert from 4 years later. That being said, I think it's worth noting that the Pet Sounds songs on In Concert could be considered promoting a current release, due to how Carl & The Passions was sold. Endless Summer stopped at Summer Days, and In Concert only includes 6 songs from that era, so there definitely was some degree of change. It may just be semantics as to how we define "oldies" in that era, but I do think that, in the aftermath of Endless Summer, a difference in status emerged between the pre- Pet Sounds material and the Pet Sounds-and-after material. In Concert was Holland-flavored. And it is not true that it was all oldies. Especially after Carl came back from his solo tour, they did some of his stuff, live. "Oldies but moldies" was also used by DJs; Mike did not coin that phrase. They did Surf's Up (Carl) in the 80s.
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Post by drbeachboy (Dirk) on Sept 18, 2023 10:34:18 GMT -5
I think the band had a demarcation line of Pet Sounds forward being considered “New” music and Barbara Ann (Party) back as the “Oldies” era.
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Post by boogieboarder on Sept 18, 2023 12:23:29 GMT -5
Currently, three Pet Sounds songs are consistently included in The Beach Boys set lists: Sloop John B God Only Knows Wouldn't It Be Nice
Looking at the set lists of their latest two concerts, Sep 16 and 17, 2023, the only songs The Beach Boys recorded later than those three from Pet Sounds are:
Do It Again Forever Rock and Roll Music (a cover of Chuck Berry’s 1957 song) Getcha Back California Dreaming (a cover of the 1965 Mamas and Papas song) Kokomo Mike’s “Pisces Brothers” and his cover of “Rockaway Beach.”
Yikes!
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Post by filledeplage on Sept 18, 2023 12:32:05 GMT -5
Currently, three Pet Sounds songs are consistently included in The Beach Boys set lists: Sloop John B God Only Knows Wouldn't It Be Nice Looking at the set lists of their latest two concerts, Sep 16 and 17, 2023, the only songs The Beach Boys recorded later than those three from Pet Sounds are: Do It Again Forever Rock and Roll Music (a cover of Chuck Berry’s 1957 song) Getcha Back California Dreaming (a cover of the 1965 Mamas and Papas song) Kokomo Mike’s “Pisces Brothers” and his cover of “Rockaway Beach.” Yikes! They tend to do Rockaway Beach more often in the NY/NJ area.
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Post by newbbfan on Sept 18, 2023 12:46:08 GMT -5
Very hard to make a bad decision if you're playing a Beach Boys song or a cool cover by related artists such as The Mamas and Papas or the ramones. Love their version of Rockaway beach.
Hope we get back to receiving some detailed information about the content and substance and release date and other details of the beach boy documentary.
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Post by Chuck's rewind on Sept 18, 2023 14:31:10 GMT -5
Very hard to make a bad decision if you're playing a Beach Boys song or a cool cover by related artists such as The Mamas and Papas or the ramones. Love their version of Rockaway beach. Hope we get back to receiving some detailed information about the content and substance and release date and other details of the beach boy documentary. Documentary update ... Please. Some body must know somebody who knows someone who knows something?!
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Post by Micha on Sept 19, 2023 13:20:01 GMT -5
Forbes: Might there be a future collaboration with the group’s surviving co-founders Brian Wilson and Al Jardine (Dennis Wilson died in 1983. Carl Wilson died in 1998.)? Mike: “There is a documentary coming out on the Beach Boys. I don't know when it's set to air. But we're definitely getting together for that. And that will be pretty nice because, you know, my cousin Brian and I go back to childhood and young adulthood— teenage years and everything. So, he went to high school with Alan Jardine.” www.forbes.com/sites/nancyberk/2023/09/15/mike-love-shares-beatles-inspiration-and-why-the-beach-boys-are-going-countryThat's pure BB logic there: Brian and Alan went to school together so they're going to collaborate in the future. No arguing with that... I don't think that's what Mike is trying to say. He isn't really answering the question, only says all three of them will meet for the documentary. And he's looking forward to that because he and Brian have known each other for so long (probably meaning there aren't many people left he can share memories from those days with), adding that Brian and Al have alSo known each other as far back as their high school days. Maybe he said "Also," but the interviewer only got "So,".
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Post by Awesoman on Sept 20, 2023 7:44:01 GMT -5
They should just do an expansion of the 𝐸𝑛𝑑𝑙𝑒𝑠𝑠 𝐻𝑎𝑟𝑚𝑜𝑛𝑦 documentary and be done with it.
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Zander
Grommet
Posts: 31
Likes: 47
Favorite Album: All Summer Long : Pet Sounds : Sunflower : Holland
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Post by Zander on Sept 20, 2023 14:01:47 GMT -5
Excuse my foggy memory, but how long was it between the "Long Promised Road" documentary being announced to actual release date? It seemed like 2 /3 years. We've had nothing solid in terms of actual announcement or promotion yet so are we talking years before we get it?
Also, unless they're going to dive in deeper into other eras of the band, what are we going to get that we haven't already seen in American Band, Endless Harmony and Doin' It Again? Not to mention the Brian Wilson Biography / BBC Wouldn't It Be Nice?
I suppose it depends on what new archival / recovered footage has been found - the recent Dennis interview after POB was an amazing find. Hopefully more of Billy Hinsche's / Ed Roach's personal footage will be used?
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Post by AGD on Sept 20, 2023 17:35:26 GMT -5
Excuse my foggy memory, but how long was it between the "Long Promised Road" documentary being announced to actual release date? It seemed like 2 /3 years. We've had nothing solid in terms of actual announcement or promotion yet so are we talking years before we get it? Also, unless they're going to dive in deeper into other eras of the band, what are we going to get that we haven't already seen in American Band, Endless Harmony and Doin' It Again? Not to mention the Brian Wilson Biography / BBC Wouldn't It Be Nice? I suppose it depends on what new archival / recovered footage has been found - the recent Dennis interview after POB was an amazing find. Hopefully more of Billy Hinsche's / Ed Roach's personal footage will be used? There was this thing called CoVid...
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Post by dauber on Sept 20, 2023 17:56:30 GMT -5
That being said, I think it's worth noting that the Pet Sounds songs on In Concert could be considered promoting a current release, due to how Carl & The Passions was sold. Endless Summer stopped at Summer Days, and In Concert only includes 6 songs from that era, so there definitely was some degree of change. It may just be semantics as to how we define "oldies" in that era, but I do think that, in the aftermath of Endless Summer, a difference in status emerged between the pre- Pet Sounds material and the Pet Sounds-and-after material.
Keep in mind that Endless Summer was a Capitol project, and they did not own the rights to any album tracks (including singles that appeared on albums) past 1965 at the time, so they were forced to draw the line there.
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Post by newbbfan on Sept 20, 2023 20:22:47 GMT -5
Well you had all the beach boys together at the Google event and very little was said and discussed. And then you had the execrable Sirius XM interview which was the most intellectually vacuous that one could possibly imagine.
So maybe the five surviving Beach Boys together in a room speaking honestly with one another in coming to terms with the way they have hurt each other over the years--or been hurt-- and the way that ego has disrupted their spiritual path, and maybe they talk about their favorite moments together of singing ,of composing, of recording, and of playing on stage , and just lay things out openly without any managers or wives or anyone else around just to express things that have never been expressed before ,openly, honestly and in true dialogue with one another. And then they pick up their instruments and play.
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