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Post by Steve Mayo on Jun 14, 2022 15:11:32 GMT -5
Never thought i’d see the day smileysmile trashes EH for negativity and be correct about it. Trashing us about treatment of howie. Howie also left a post there. I believe this place has ran him off. Don’t blame him.  Sad. Thought we were better than that. |
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swonk
Grommet
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Post by swonk on Jun 14, 2022 15:40:54 GMT -5
I don't blame him either, but at the same time, I hope people's valid criticism isn't being brushed off just because he's not happy with how we're receiving these new mixes. Feel like this large a response with many people echoing the same problems should be some sort of warning sign to maybe at least look into it? I just want previously unreleased material to sound good for future releases, if we just went back to how they sounded in 2017, that'd be perfect.
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Post by drbeachboy (Dirk) on Jun 14, 2022 15:45:59 GMT -5
Never thought i’d see the day smileysmile trashes eh for negativity and be correct about it. Trashing us about treatment of howie. Howie also left a post there. I believe this place has ran him off. Don’t blame him. Sad. Thought we were better than that. Sorry, but Howie creates his own issues with the things he says. And if they think we are creating Malt Shop Memories then they are completely off the mark. All we want is the Beach Boys to sound like The Beach Boys, not Death Metal. Capisce? |
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Post by drbeachboy (Dirk) on Jun 14, 2022 15:53:30 GMT -5
Also, instead of addressing any number of things brought up in here and maybe clearing the air a little bit, he'd rather again just admonish us. Only this time he runs to SS to do it.
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Post by #JusticeForDonGoldberg on Jun 14, 2022 16:00:33 GMT -5
I don't blame him either, but at the same time, I hope people's valid criticism isn't being brushed off just because he's not happy with how we're receiving these new mixes. Feel like this large a response with many people echoing the same problems should be some sort of warning sign to maybe at least look into it? I just want previously unreleased material to sound good for future releases, if we just went back to how they sounded in 2017, that'd be perfect. very much agree with this. Howie clearly has his heart in the right place, Mark and Alan are Clearly a duo with the potential to kick some serious ass as they have done several times in the past, if everything could be at the level of quality that “Sunshine Tomorrow” was, I would be a happy camper. But yes, I agree that the Howie bashing may have become a bit much, despite my concerns with some of his comments. But I guess people are going to feel how they feel and there’s not much you can do about it |
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Post by debonbon on Jun 14, 2022 19:46:03 GMT -5
I don't blame him either, but at the same time, I hope people's valid criticism isn't being brushed off just because he's not happy with how we're receiving these new mixes. Feel like this large a response with many people echoing the same problems should be some sort of warning sign to maybe at least look into it? I just want previously unreleased material to sound good for future releases, if we just went back to how they sounded in 2017, that'd be perfect. I’ve seen no valid criticism, just opinions. |
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Post by #JusticeForDonGoldberg on Jun 14, 2022 20:23:58 GMT -5
I don't blame him either, but at the same time, I hope people's valid criticism isn't being brushed off just because he's not happy with how we're receiving these new mixes. Feel like this large a response with many people echoing the same problems should be some sort of warning sign to maybe at least look into it? I just want previously unreleased material to sound good for future releases, if we just went back to how they sounded in 2017, that'd be perfect. I’ve seen no valid criticism, just opinions. criticism is opinions. That’s literally what criticism is. |
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Post by goodvibrations33 on Jun 14, 2022 20:34:55 GMT -5
I don’t blame Howie, either. Sometimes you just gotta bite your tongue and be grateful for what we do get from the band/record companies. They don’t owe us anything. (Mark, Alan, Howie, etc., are all rooting on behalf of us fans to the execs to get as much stuff out to the public as possible.) You can state your opinion, everyone is absolutely entitled to that, but carrying it on and on and on and on serves no useful purpose.
It’s our fandom that makes us so passionate about the band, product, the way we interpret how the music sounds, etc.; but when that turns into the negativity that appeared on this board over the weekend, it gets to a very unfortunate and out of hand place. Be the example, set the example, and treat others the way you’d treat yourself.
Honestly, while I was reading the posts this weekend coming in I couldn’t help but think how similar it felt to some of the worst weird posting drama that has happened over at Smiley Smile in the past. Allowed to go too far.
No one is perfect, I’m definitely not, but I believe everyone is better than the example that was set on this board this weekend.
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Post by debonbon on Jun 14, 2022 20:36:58 GMT -5
I’ve seen no valid criticism, just opinions. criticism is opinions. That’s literally what criticism is. Fine, I’ve not seen anything valid. |
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Post by 1975aqex on Jun 14, 2022 20:59:25 GMT -5
Oh Christ Howie, grow a set
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Post by 1975aqex on Jun 14, 2022 21:04:15 GMT -5
...And I say that lovingly...
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Post by #JusticeForDonGoldberg on Jun 14, 2022 21:22:28 GMT -5
criticism is opinions. That’s literally what criticism is. Fine, I’ve not seen anything valid. Well The overwhelming majority on here and elsewhere, from what I’ve seen, mentioned heavy treble and compression as their concerns, and I find both of those things very valid as someone who takes issue with both of them. |
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Post by #JusticeForDonGoldberg on Jun 14, 2022 21:30:37 GMT -5
Speaking of, I opened Apple Music earlier today and was excited to see that both shut down and good vibrations had their spatial audio/Dolby Atmos mixes available.
So I go ahead and pop the headphones in, click shut down and… I’m delightfully surprised.
The treble that overwhelmed the new stereo mix was a complete nonissue in Atmos. It was much less harsh on the ears.
And the vocals just pop, especially in the bridge.
Its everything the New stereo mix could and should have been.
Now good vibrations in Atmos is a bit more of a mixed bag, mainly just because since there’s way more space in the mix (they call it spatial audio for a reason) The artifacts on the isolated lead vocals is a bit more noticeable, but even still it sounds great to me.
And i’m truly excited to hear the rest of the first disc in Atmos.
Especially the Pet Sounds and forward tracks where there’s a lot more things they can do with the expanded amount of tracks available.
And I’m hopeful that one day they’ll decide to remix the second and third discs into atmos.
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Post by debonbon on Jun 14, 2022 22:04:40 GMT -5
Fine, I’ve not seen anything valid. Well The overwhelming majority on here and elsewhere, from what I’ve seen, mentioned heavy treble and compression as their concerns, and I find both of those things very valid as someone who takes issue with both of them. I love the new mixes, they sound BIG. Shut Down especially sounds in a whole new world. 60s Beach Boys records sound tiny, nothing wrong with it and I love that too, these mixes are just a different take. It’s just a band and it’s just music, it isn’t the end of the world. People need to relax. |
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Post by northcoast on Jun 14, 2022 22:15:17 GMT -5
Folks you like the new mixes, listen to them to your heart's content. You don't like them then go back and play the original mixes. Isn't it great to have options?
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Post by #JusticeForDonGoldberg on Jun 14, 2022 22:18:00 GMT -5
Well The overwhelming majority on here and elsewhere, from what I’ve seen, mentioned heavy treble and compression as their concerns, and I find both of those things very valid as someone who takes issue with both of them. I love the new mixes, they sound BIG. Shut Down especially sounds in a whole new world. 60s Beach Boys records sound tiny, nothing wrong with it and I love that too, these mixes are just a different take. It’s just a band and it’s just music, it isn’t the end of the world. People need to relax. obviously it’s not the end of the world, but you are on a Beach boys message board. If you want to talk about *real* important issues in the world there are thousands, maybe millions at this point, of different places you could go to talk about that. Yes, in the grand scheme of things, the sound quality of a Beach boys compilation is all the way at the bottom of the list of things that are important. But for us who do care, for us who make this group a huge part of our lives, we care about this stuff, both positive and negative. I just said how pleasantly delighted and surprised I was by the dolby Atmos mix of shut down, I think it’s beautiful. There’s something positive right there. I’ve talked about how I like certain aspects of the new Marcella mix, and don’t like others. If you absolutely love everything about it, that’s fantastic, I am happy for you. |
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Post by Rick Bartlett on Jun 14, 2022 22:47:55 GMT -5
Well, it doesn't show much for the character of the guy, if he has to pick up hit bat and ball and sook somewhere else. Everything that was questioned or asked was legitimate, and most of what was said, a lot of it was quoted from his own mouth! What is wrong asking for explanations and giving feedback to the music buying crowd that's actually 'buying' this stuff? Some people just have to be told they're doing a perfect job, even if they are not, but people also have become a little 'soft' when it comes to constructive criticism and interpret that as offense. Where is everybody getting off with saying the members are slinging all this 'hate'?? A couple comments maybe poor taste, but seriously? This ain't nothing to what 'Smiley' has been through many times and terribly worse, that's why this place exists. In all seriousness, I wish Howie would take a chill pill, calm down, and come back and talk about this stuff. Don't make it into something that it's not.
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Post by gigantiskpyjamas on Jun 14, 2022 23:21:00 GMT -5
What’s up with the ”Us vs. Them” mentality between the EH and SS forums?
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Post by tomtomplayboy on Jun 15, 2022 1:28:23 GMT -5
Well The overwhelming majority on here and elsewhere, from what I’ve seen, mentioned heavy treble and compression as their concerns, and I find both of those things very valid as someone who takes issue with both of them. I love the new mixes, they sound BIG. Shut Down especially sounds in a whole new world. 60s Beach Boys records sound tiny, nothing wrong with it and I love that too, these mixes are just a different take. It’s just a band and it’s just music, it isn’t the end of the world. People need to relax. If I'm going to spend £100 of my hard-earned money on a box-set covering two of my all-time favourite albums (Sunflower and Surf's Up), I'd rather not discover that it is filled with audio problems, with major compression and treble issues. No one is claiming it's 'the end of the world', but, for many of us, it is hugely frustrating and disappointing, and something we really don't want repeating with the CATP/Holland set. If a conversation with one of the people behind the box-set on a Beach Boys forum isn't the place to voice such concerns, where is? |
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Post by tomtomplayboy on Jun 15, 2022 1:31:01 GMT -5
If Endless Harmony is the forum where people speak honestly and openly about the audio issues of Feel Flows then I'm glad this is the forum I follow.
And Howie hardly covered himself with glory with his own comments, which were sometimes childish and deliberately provocative. When I objected to a new remix of Baby Blue being described by him as 'definitive', he replied 'go listen to your 2-fer CDs'. Not exactly a professional response. (And a bit rich given how much better the 2000 2-fers sound to anything we've had in the last two years.)
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Post by filledeplage on Jun 15, 2022 7:34:51 GMT -5
If Endless Harmony is the forum where people speak honestly and openly about the audio issues of Feel Flows then I'm glad this is the forum I follow. And Howie hardly covered himself with glory with his own comments, which were sometimes childish and deliberately provocative. When I objected to a new remix of Baby Blue being described by him as 'definitive', he replied 'go listen to your 2-fer CDs'. Not exactly a professional response. (And a bit rich given how much better the 2000 2-fers sound to anything we've had in the last two years.) And that exactly is how this forum came to be. It is called freedom of speech from the first amendment. Thanks, Doc! ⭐️🎶 What is crazy is that the press were as biased as can be in the 60s and certainly not neutral about the band, filled with condescension, infatuated with some bands, marginalizing others, and that extended to the fans as well. They acted as though they were “picking the winners.” They were creating stereotypes. They did pick the winners and it was not this band. Thank God this band became a bunch of adaptive survivors. But when lifer fans have an “informed” opinion, or others who have developed a certain expertise, say in sound technics, which is different from a gloss-over response about a pair of shoes or hat, that does not conform with a certain narrative, you may as well remain silent and let the blathering just prattle on and let them think they are right. If those from “oh high” - are watching, they would do well to take a look at what is going on and I would bet they are. It opened the “dialogue” and not “a narrative.” That is exactly the point of free expression. The threads, here, developed as a result of that podcast, that none of us had anything to do with. In a sense it was a review of the podcast. You get both sides with reviews, both good and bad. This is not a hateful forum; far from it. They listen to your points and at least give it airspace, even if uncomfortable or unpopular to see where you are coming from to arrive at that point-of-view. Bravo to that! 🥇 |
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Post by boogieboarder on Jun 15, 2022 8:53:23 GMT -5
Actually, it looks to me like Howard’s post on Smiley Smile is actually a confession of exactly what he’s being accused of on this board - thinking that The Beach Boys are “malt shop memories” that he’s been assigned to “right the wrongs” and “make the band relevant to a modern young audience.” Something that in no way should or needs to be done at all.
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Post by filledeplage on Jun 15, 2022 9:15:48 GMT -5
Actually, it looks to me like Howard’s post on Smiley Smile is actually a confession of exactly what he’s being accused of on this board - thinking that The Beach Boys are “malt shop memories” that he’s been assigned to “right the wrongs” and “make the band relevant to a modern young audience.” Something that in no way should or needs to be done at all. The “right the wrongs,” in my book, are connected to the media coverage, and that is his domain and his industry that he should be chiding and correcting-the-record. It is certainly not the music production. It was the litany of false perceptions that were or need to be corrected. Sort of a True or False exercise and that is his domain, not the studio. He could watch or re-watch the interviews from 1970 and the evolution of the music. Take a deep dive into the negative articles written by the heavy hitters and respond to them in the parallel manner to the way Paul McCartney dealt with his blackballing. Talking about “Malt Shop Memories” is a distraction from the actual issues - it is playing patty-cake at the heavy-weight championship. Be their defender. Go big or go home. |
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Post by Will/P.P. on Jun 15, 2022 10:24:39 GMT -5
What’s up with the ”Us vs. Them” mentality between the EH and SS forums? Just go read some of the history. Check the Sandbox. Many of us use our real names. I was feelsflow 'cause it was the first message board I'd ever signed up for, and wasn't sure if my identity could/would be stolen. I use my real first and last name at some sites. Fingers crossed, nobody has yet to get into my accounts in ten years. Anyway, not this message board but the one before it (gone now) was created because so many of us were banned or made to feel unwelcome at Smiley. For simply stating our opinions. That is not the case here at Endless Harmony -The Best Beach Boys forum. |
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Post by tomtomplayboy on Jun 15, 2022 13:14:05 GMT -5
What’s up with the ”Us vs. Them” mentality between the EH and SS forums? Just go read some of the history. Check the Sandbox. Many of us use our real names. I was feelsflow 'cause it was the first message board I'd ever signed up for, and wasn't sure if my identity could/would be stolen. I use my real first and last name at some sites. Fingers crossed, nobody has yet to get into my accounts in ten years. Anyway, not this message board but the one before it (gone now) was created because so many of us were banned or made to feel unwelcome at Smiley. For simply stating our opinions. That is not the case here at Endless Harmony -The Best Beach Boys forum. I joined Smiley Smile years ago, and used my own name. Regretted both decisions pretty quickly. I left and have never been tempted to go back. This forum is infinitely superior and more pleasant in every conceivable way. |
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