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Post by AGD on Jan 18, 2024 15:42:11 GMT -5
Seeing as I've got the daily posting figures going back five years, it seems a bit of a waste for them to gather dust on my hard drive, so for them as finds this kind of thing interesting, read on. Iffn you don't, it might be a good idea to bail now. First up, 2019, and a few introductory caveats. While I've got a complete set of daily figures for EH, I only have those for SS from February 1st, and for BBT from March 14th. So, first the raw figures:
| Jan | Feb | Mar | Apr | May | June | July
| Aug | Sep | Oct
| Nov
| Dec | Total | EH
| 3462
| 2268
| 1681
| 1153
| 986
| 800
| 832
| 1030
| 1041
| 820
| 925
| 1004
| 15,999
| SS
|
| 804
| 1028
| 740
| 1157
| 1065
| 994
| 978
| 983
| 693
| 806
| 925
| 10,173
| TD
|
|
| 566
| 505
| 449
| 466
| 504
| 602
| 585
| 838
| 841
| 678
| 6,034
|
Now, with some additional figures: basically, what I did was divide the SS total by 334 and then multiply that by 31 to get a January figure, and for BBT by 293, then times that by 31, 28 and 13. It's not perfect, but close enough I reckon. Anyhoo...
| Jan
| Feb
| Mar
| Apr
| May
| June
| July
| Aug
| Sep
| Oct
| Nov
| Dec
| Total
| %
| EH
| 3462
| 2268
| 1681
| 1153
| 986
| 800
| 832
| 1030
| 1041
| 820
| 925
| 1004
| 15,999 | 46.17
| SS
| 994
| 804
| 1028
| 740
| 1157
| 1065
| 994
| 978
| 983
| 693
| 806
| 925
| 11,117
| 32.08
| TD
| 673
| 575
| 820
| 505
| 449
| 466
| 504
| 602
| 585
| 838
| 841
| 678
| 7,536
| 21.75
|
So that was the state of play in 2019: just for the complete picture, during the nine days EH existed in 2018, there were 1003 posts.
Coming soon to a forum near you: 2020!
Edit: as has been pointed out to me, I left the January posts out of the EH total. Duh.
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Post by AGD on Jan 19, 2024 9:55:02 GMT -5
2020, the first year will full stats for all three boards.
| Jan
| Feb
| Mar
| Apr
| May
| Jun
| Jul
| Aug
| Sep
| Oct
| Nov
| Dec
| Total
| %
| EH
| 1120
| 1474
| 1119
| 1057
| 1207
| 1256
| 1241
| 1096
| 1117
| 1072
| 856
| 1159
| 13,774
| 37.20
| SS
| 899
| 1250
| 786
| 997
| 1219
| 726
| 1017
| 830
| 1177
| 1299
| 872
| 801
| 11,873
| 32.06
| TD
| 829
| 785
| 1150
| 1247
| 822
| 784
| 779
| 999
| 919
| 1139
| 1075
| 856
| 11,384
| 30.74
|
Year on year changes:
| +/- | % | EH
| -4425 | -13.91
| SS
| +756 | +6.80
| TD
| +3848 | +51.06
|
Not much explanation required. Covid, and no touring, didn't seem to really impact the posting. Nor did the lack of a CopEx release this year. In general, a levelling out. SS held its share of the posts almost exactly.
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Post by jk on Jan 19, 2024 13:44:17 GMT -5
Seeing as I've got the daily posting figures going back five years, it seems a bit of a waste for them to gather dust on my hard drive, so for them as finds this kind of thing interesting, read on. Iffn you don't, it might be a good idea to bail now. First up, 2019, and a few introductory caveats. While I've got a complete set of daily figures for EH, I only have those for SS from February 1st, and for BBT from March 14th. So, first the raw figures:
| Jan | Feb | Mar | Apr | May | June | July
| Aug | Sep | Oct
| Nov
| Dec | Total | EH
| 3462
| 2268
| 1681
| 1153
| 986
| 800
| 832
| 1030
| 1041
| 820
| 925
| 1004
| 15,999
| SS
|
| 804
| 1028
| 740
| 1157
| 1065
| 994
| 978
| 983
| 693
| 806
| 925
| 10,173
| TD
|
|
| 566
| 505
| 449
| 466
| 504
| 602
| 585
| 838
| 841
| 678
| 6,034
|
Now, with some additional figures: basically, what I did was divide the SS total by 334 and then multiply that by 31 to get a January figure, and for BBT by 293, then times that by 31, 28 and 13. It's not perfect, but close enough I reckon. Anyhoo...
| Jan
| Feb
| Mar
| Apr
| May
| June
| July
| Aug
| Sep
| Oct
| Nov
| Dec
| Total
| %
| EH
| 3462
| 2268
| 1681
| 1153
| 986
| 800
| 832
| 1030
| 1041
| 820
| 925
| 1004
| 15,999 | 46.17
| SS
| 994
| 804
| 1028
| 740
| 1157
| 1065
| 994
| 978
| 983
| 693
| 806
| 925
| 11,117
| 32.08
| TD
| 673
| 575
| 820
| 505
| 449
| 466
| 504
| 602
| 585
| 838
| 841
| 678
| 7,536
| 21.75
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I love stuff like this! Which is not to say I can wrap my simple brain round all of it (that sentence in bold, for example). I also like the Dragnet reference -- or could it be " Dragonet"?
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Post by AGD on Jan 19, 2024 13:58:02 GMT -5
You knew this was coming: 2021...
| Jan
| Feb
| Mar
| Apr
| May
| Jun
| Jul
| Aug
| Sep
| Oct
| Nov
| Dec
| Total
| %
| EH
| 1021
| 1230
| 1157
| 1919
| 1449
| 2146
| 1111
| 1684
| 1662
| 1021
| 711
| 949
| 16,060 | 45.02 | SS
| 787
| 830
| 591
| 601
| 619
| 898
| 730
| 1036
| 668
| 401
| 473
| 226
| 7,860
| 22.03
| TD
| 705
| 668
| 947
| 804
| 968
| 1247
| 1211
| 1331
| 1088
| 1040
| 909
| 835
| 11,753
| 32.95
|
Year on year changes:
| +/-
| %
| EH
| +2286
| +16.60
| SS
| -4013
| -33.80
| TD
| +369
| +3.24
|
Another year of stability for TD, and EH regained lost ground (and a little more) but the posting levels at SS declined alarmingly, for no apparent reason. This year there was a CopEx release to dissect, and touring resumed.
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Post by AGD on Jan 19, 2024 14:03:14 GMT -5
Seeing as I've got the daily posting figures going back five years, it seems a bit of a waste for them to gather dust on my hard drive, so for them as finds this kind of thing interesting, read on. Iffn you don't, it might be a good idea to bail now. First up, 2019, and a few introductory caveats. While I've got a complete set of daily figures for EH, I only have those for SS from February 1st, and for BBT from March 14th. So, first the raw figures:
| Jan | Feb | Mar | Apr | May | June | July
| Aug | Sep | Oct
| Nov
| Dec | Total | EH
| 3462
| 2268
| 1681
| 1153
| 986
| 800
| 832
| 1030
| 1041
| 820
| 925
| 1004
| 15,999
| SS
|
| 804
| 1028
| 740
| 1157
| 1065
| 994
| 978
| 983
| 693
| 806
| 925
| 10,173
| TD
|
|
| 566
| 505
| 449
| 466
| 504
| 602
| 585
| 838
| 841
| 678
| 6,034
|
Now, with some additional figures: basically, what I did was divide the SS total by 334 and then multiply that by 31 to get a January figure, and for BBT by 293, then times that by 31, 28 and 13. It's not perfect, but close enough I reckon. Anyhoo...
| Jan
| Feb
| Mar
| Apr
| May
| June
| July
| Aug
| Sep
| Oct
| Nov
| Dec
| Total
| %
| EH
| 3462
| 2268
| 1681
| 1153
| 986
| 800
| 832
| 1030
| 1041
| 820
| 925
| 1004
| 15,999 | 46.17
| SS
| 994
| 804
| 1028
| 740
| 1157
| 1065
| 994
| 978
| 983
| 693
| 806
| 925
| 11,117
| 32.08
| TD
| 673
| 575
| 820
| 505
| 449
| 466
| 504
| 602
| 585
| 838
| 841
| 678
| 7,536
| 21.75
|
I love stuff like this! Which is not to say I can wrap my simple brain round all of it (that sentence in bold, for example). I also like the Dragnet reference -- or could it be " Dragonet"? Me being obtuse: for SS I divided the Feb-Dec total by 334 (365-31) then multiplied that figure by 31 to get an averaged January total. For TD, I did essentially the same for January & February: for March I multiplied the 293 day average by 13 and added it to the existing posts from 14th-31st. Again, it's not perfect but it's as close as it gets. If anyone can somehow retrive the SS posting figure for January 2019, I'd be as thrilled as I would be amazed.
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Post by bessieboporbach on Jan 19, 2024 15:56:03 GMT -5
I have to admit I find it a bit weird how much attention seems to be paid on this forum to what's happening (or not happening) on other Beach Boys forums.
I feel like I have wandered inadvertently into some kind of simmering private argument, like when you walk into the kitchen and your parents are glaring at each other.
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Post by AGD on Jan 19, 2024 16:27:38 GMT -5
You don't know the history.
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Post by filledeplage on Jan 19, 2024 16:37:35 GMT -5
I have to admit I find it a bit weird how much attention seems to be paid on this forum to what's happening (or not happening) on other Beach Boys forums. I feel like I have wandered inadvertently into some kind of simmering private argument, like when you walk into the kitchen and your parents are glaring at each other. Maybe not - it may create that impression for some who have just discovered this online community but those who go back, way back, to the inception of the internet, have had many fora for discussion and exchange of ideas and info. It appears they are remembered, fondly, and with a few chuckles. They have not all been contentious. Some of these fora have dissolved or became disbanded for whatever reason. Some of this contentiousness arose a little prior to (maybe earlier) to C50 - the 50th "reunion" tour. The difference on this forum, is that there is a higher level of tolerance for a variety of ideas and positions so long as they are supported with facts. And that policy has gradually attracted the experts in this hallowed BB sphere, who are accorded with deference and respect. This forum started at ground zero in December of 2018. The membership growth alone, a source of pride, is consistent with a forum that is run/managed with tolerance. So, is attention paid to growth and percentages of participation? Yes, indeed.
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Post by bessieboporbach on Jan 19, 2024 18:44:46 GMT -5
You don't know the history. Like everyone else here, I am interested in the Beach Boys and the minutiae of their history and music. But I really, really, *extremely* don't care about disputes between groups of fans on the internet, and frankly I think it makes a forum look...not great to hash out such things publically. Right now the top two threads here are about other forums. I know not a lot is going on in Beach Boys land now that they are octogenarians, but things like Karmafrog's Pet Squares videos on YouTube seem to be something new and ongoing that's worth talking about, just to name one small example.
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Post by drbeachboy (Dirk) on Jan 19, 2024 22:13:27 GMT -5
You don't know the history. Like everyone else here, I am interested in the Beach Boys and the minutiae of their history and music. But I really, really, *extremely* don't care about disputes between groups of fans on the internet, and frankly I think it makes a forum look...not great to hash out such things publically. Right now the top two threads here are about other forums. I know not a lot is going on in Beach Boys land now that they are octogenarians, but things like Karmafrog's Pet Squares videos on YouTube seem to be something new and ongoing that's worth talking about, just to name one small example. Then I suggest that you not visit this thread. There are plenty of threads here to hopefully draw your interest. As I have mentioned more than once, this place would not even exist if it wasn't for what went down at SSMB. If you were not a part of that history, then please ignore this thread completely. Thank you. Oh, and please feel free to post about Pet Squares as much as you feel is needed. I am sure Adam will appreciate it.
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Post by AGD on Jan 20, 2024 1:57:48 GMT -5
You don't know the history. Like everyone else here, I am interested in the Beach Boys and the minutiae of their history and music. But I really, really, *extremely* don't care about disputes between groups of fans on the internet, and frankly I think it makes a forum look...not great to hash out such things publically. Right now the top two threads here are about other forums. I know not a lot is going on in Beach Boys land now that they are octogenarians, but things like Karmafrog's Pet Squares videos on YouTube seem to be something new and ongoing that's worth talking about, just to name one small example. Then really, really, *extremely* don't read this thread or any other that obviously adresses this topic. Problem solved.
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Post by AGD on Jan 20, 2024 4:09:53 GMT -5
Anyhoo... 2022:
| Jan
| Feb
| Mar
| Apr
| May
| Jun
| Jul
| Aug
| Sep
| Oct
| Nov
| Dec
| Total
| %
| EH | 1426
| 726
| 1099
| 879
| 1024
| 1926
| 1659
| 1092
| 1086
| 1222
| 747
| 1574
| 14,510
| 47.63
| SS
| 287
| 184
| 406
| 236
| 318
| 583
| 948
| 558
| 545
| 246
| 149
| 396
| 4,856
| 15.94
| TD | 1102
| 842
| 917
| 750
| 896
| 935
| 937
| 1203
| 892
| 1035
| 797
| 795
| 11,101
| 36.44
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And the year on year changes:
| +/- | % | EH | -1550
| -9.65
| SS | -3004
| -38.22
| TD | -652
| -5.55
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Again, TD generally maintains its overall posting percentage - up a few points, actually - but there's a dropoff in posts across the boards (notably SS), which is odd considering it was a year with a new CopEx release and full touring. Anyone got any idea why?
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Post by bessieboporbach on Jan 20, 2024 7:10:03 GMT -5
Like everyone else here, I am interested in the Beach Boys and the minutiae of their history and music. But I really, really, *extremely* don't care about disputes between groups of fans on the internet, and frankly I think it makes a forum look...not great to hash out such things publically. Right now the top two threads here are about other forums. I know not a lot is going on in Beach Boys land now that they are octogenarians, but things like Karmafrog's Pet Squares videos on YouTube seem to be something new and ongoing that's worth talking about, just to name one small example. Then I suggest that you not visit this thread. There are plenty of threads here to hopefully draw your interest. As I have mentioned more than once, this place would not even exist if it wasn't for what went down at SSMB. If you were not a part of that history, then please ignore this thread completely. Thank you. Oh, and please feel free to post about Pet Squares as much as you feel is needed. I am sure Adam will appreciate it. OK, fair enough, I was not part of that "history" and no new members that you are likely to pick up will be either. What I was trying to suggest (delicately) is that this sort of thing embarrasses the forum, especially when it's public like this. If the mods disagree, or don't mind, then that's fine. But you should know the impression this kind of thing gives. It comes down to whether this is supposed to be a Beach Boys forum or a "Beach Boys forum drama" forum.
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Post by AGD on Jan 20, 2024 7:23:32 GMT -5
I'm trying to find any drama in this thread (other than that which you've introduced) and failing completely. Care to point it out to me?
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Post by filledeplage on Jan 20, 2024 7:48:20 GMT -5
Then I suggest that you not visit this thread. There are plenty of threads here to hopefully draw your interest. As I have mentioned more than once, this place would not even exist if it wasn't for what went down at SSMB. If you were not a part of that history, then please ignore this thread completely. Thank you. Oh, and please feel free to post about Pet Squares as much as you feel is needed. I am sure Adam will appreciate it. OK, fair enough, I was not part of that "history" and no new members that you are likely to pick up will be either. What I was trying to suggest (delicately) is that this sort of thing embarrasses the forum, especially when it's public like this. If the mods disagree, or don't mind, then that's fine. But you should know the impression this kind of thing gives. It comes down to whether this is supposed to be a Beach Boys forum or a "Beach Boys forum drama" forum. Is this some attempt to shame an analysis of member participation? Or, suggest that members self-censor what others might consider as uncomfortable? The constitutional remedy for "uncomfortable speech" is more "uncomfortable speech." The numbers don't lie. Andrew was "quantifying" what participation was, and not editorializing it. It was not a value judgment but supporting a position which is encouraged here. Support your position with facts. Who is embarrassed? I'm embarrassed that I don't do that kind of basic statistical analysis. I didn't minor psychology because the thought of all that math would make me throw up, but freely admit that deficit. I leave that to others. If that forum comes back online, you might go back and read a few hundred threads and pages to see what happened over there. It is a triumph to reach this membership and participation level, in my opinion. Running a basic participation analysis or taking attendance in school, hardly qualifies as embarrassing unless it is somehow contorted into that narrative. Numbers are neutral.
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Post by E on Jan 20, 2024 8:39:16 GMT -5
OK, fair enough, I was not part of that "history" and no new members that you are likely to pick up will be either. What I was trying to suggest (delicately) is that this sort of thing embarrasses the forum, especially when it's public like this. If the mods disagree, or don't mind, then that's fine. But you should know the impression this kind of thing gives. It comes down to whether this is supposed to be a Beach Boys forum or a "Beach Boys forum drama" forum. The last time SS went down, it was someone here who contacted the site owner, who, until that point (because his interests lie elsewhere: God, comic books and, if I recall correctly from the Shut Down board those many years ago, rightwing politics - though I'm assuming he may have a family now too) was unaware and was accordingly grateful. There was no drama in this thread, until now. Just the stats, as the title says.
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Post by drbeachboy (Dirk) on Jan 20, 2024 10:07:08 GMT -5
Then I suggest that you not visit this thread. There are plenty of threads here to hopefully draw your interest. As I have mentioned more than once, this place would not even exist if it wasn't for what went down at SSMB. If you were not a part of that history, then please ignore this thread completely. Thank you. Oh, and please feel free to post about Pet Squares as much as you feel is needed. I am sure Adam will appreciate it. OK, fair enough, I was not part of that "history" and no new members that you are likely to pick up will be either. What I was trying to suggest (delicately) is that this sort of thing embarrasses the forum, especially when it's public like this. If the mods disagree, or don't mind, then that's fine. But you should know the impression this kind of thing gives. It comes down to whether this is supposed to be a Beach Boys forum or a "Beach Boys forum drama" forum. Apparently, not “fair enough” for you, as you continue to ramble on about it. If someone wants to track and post the results of postings across the three forums, then fine. Statistical data is collected and measured for all types of things. This forum’s history is not an embarrassment.
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ryankc
Dude/Dudette
Posts: 97
Likes: 175
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Post by ryankc on Jan 20, 2024 10:45:51 GMT -5
To me, what hurt Smiley Smile over time... 1) Website going down frequently 2) Search functions not always working 3) Hardly anyone posted there. When they came back on after the most recent offline, they all said, "We're back!" and then no one posted anything else after that. I was not a part of the history. I understand why it'd not be of interest to some fans, but as AGD stated in the original post: "so for them as finds this kind of thing interesting, read on. Iffn you don't, it might be a good idea to bail now. "
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Post by jk on Jan 21, 2024 5:20:17 GMT -5
If someone wants to track and post the results of postings across the three forums, then fine. Statistical data is collected and measured for all types of things. This forum’s history is not an embarrassment. Ah, another "forums" person. That's a relief!! As I see it, AGD and JH notwithstanding, the Ancient Romans debated in fora and we modern types debate on forums.
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Post by filledeplage on Jan 21, 2024 7:34:09 GMT -5
If someone wants to track and post the results of postings across the three forums, then fine. Statistical data is collected and measured for all types of things. This forum’s history is not an embarrassment. Ah, another "forums" person. That's a relief!! As I see it, AGD and JH notwithstanding, the Ancient Romans debated in fora and we modern types debate on forums. jk - forum - it is kind of a public square or gladiator stadium, which these platforms can become. 😂 Internet is supposed to be the "public square" for debate, etc. Is it different from gladiators' stadia? Hardly. There are legal connotations, but it is second declension, in Latin, with the nominative case as fora in the plural column. Dirk used it correctly as he was speaking about one, this platform, in singular form. That said, there has been a movement going back several decades to strip out a lot of Latin use in the law, so the public feels it is more accessible, but I don't think it has been that successful. It is probably acceptable to use either.
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Post by jk on Jan 21, 2024 8:03:49 GMT -5
jk - forum - it is kind of a public square or gladiator stadium, which these platforms can become. 😂 Internet is supposed to be the "public square" for debate, etc. Is it different from gladiators' stadia? Hardly. There are legal connotations, but it is second declension, in Latin, with the nominative case as fora in the plural column. Dirk used it correctly as he was speaking about one, this platform, in singular form. That said, there has been a movement going back several decades to strip out a lot of Latin use in the law, so the public feels it is more accessible, but I don't think it has been that successful. It is probably acceptable to use either. Most interesting, FDP. I have nothing against Latin, in fact it was my favourite subject at school! I think you'll find Dirk also used forum in the plural form ("postings across the three forums"). My problem (if you can call it that!) is with the preposition preceding it. "In fora" makes perfect sense, but " on fora"? To each their own, of course.
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Post by filledeplage on Jan 21, 2024 8:15:28 GMT -5
jk - forum - it is kind of a public square or gladiator stadium, which these platforms can become. 😂 Internet is supposed to be the "public square" for debate, etc. Is it different from gladiators' stadia? Hardly. There are legal connotations, but it is second declension, in Latin, with the nominative case as fora in the plural column. Dirk used it correctly as he was speaking about one, this platform, in singular form. That said, there has been a movement going back several decades to strip out a lot of Latin use in the law, so the public feels it is more accessible, but I don't think it has been that successful. It is probably acceptable to use either. Most interesting, FDP. I have nothing against Latin, in fact it was my favourite subject at school! I think you'll find Dirk also used forum in the plural form ("postings across the three forums"). My problem (if you can call it that!) is with the preposition preceding it. "In fora" makes perfect sense, but " on fora"? To each their own, of course. That is my go-to. Latin. It is where many of our languages come from. Language evolves all the time, and pushes our comfort zone. And an "s" after forum in English makes it plural. We have all this internet language (I don't mean the technical stuff but products themselves) that has evolved, since computers became mainstream and now your phone is a computer. Learning Latin in school was always a guarantee of about a hundred points value on the college entrance exams on the verbal exam. I think it still has great value, since it is still used in medicine and law. I'd take Latin over Math any old day. But this public square is far more informal - the way it should be.
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Post by jk on Jan 21, 2024 8:52:37 GMT -5
That is my go-to. Latin. It is where many of our languages come from. Language evolves all the time, and pushes our comfort zone. And an "s" after forum in English makes it plural. We have all this internet language (I don't mean the technical stuff but products themselves) that has evolved, since computers became mainstream and now your phone is a computer. Learning Latin in school was always a guarantee of about a hundred points value on the college entrance exams on the verbal exam. I think it still has great value, since it is still used in medicine and law. I'd take Latin over Math any old day. But this public square is far more informal - the way it should be. Not to forget what good old Carl Linnaeus left us. Entomology is an endlessly fascinating subject, particularly moths and beetles. Thinks: Are we still on stats? Of course we are (Ma'am)!
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Post by filledeplage on Jan 21, 2024 10:54:00 GMT -5
That is my go-to. Latin. It is where many of our languages come from. Language evolves all the time, and pushes our comfort zone. And an "s" after forum in English makes it plural. We have all this internet language (I don't mean the technical stuff but products themselves) that has evolved, since computers became mainstream and now your phone is a computer. Learning Latin in school was always a guarantee of about a hundred points value on the college entrance exams on the verbal exam. I think it still has great value, since it is still used in medicine and law. I'd take Latin over Math any old day. But this public square is far more informal - the way it should be. Not to forget what good old Carl Linnaeus left us. Entomology is an endlessly fascinating subject, particularly moths and beetles. Thinks: Are we still on stats? Of course we are (Ma'am)! Very true. I think lawyers groups wanted to make the law seem more accessible because they have a terrible reputation. Of course scientists, including biologists, use Latin.
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alankard
Dude/Dudette
Module-Assembly Smile Hobbyist (MASH)
Posts: 52
Likes: 53
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Post by alankard on Jan 21, 2024 13:17:41 GMT -5
Again, TD generally maintains its overall posting percentage - up a few points, actually - but there's a dropoff in posts across the boards (notably SS), which is odd considering it was a year with a new CopEx release and full touring. Anyone got any idea why?
First blush, 2022 was when vaccines and boosters started to take hold and there was a collective feeling of "Enough!" with restrictions, time to get out and about for the scent of roses without a mask -- away from the home computer. Digging deeper, the stats are interesting but might need to be broken out more to illustrate specific trends (I know absolutely nothing about what stat collection ProBoards even offers to mods and interested users). However, as a new guy who wandered in, it feels like there is a core group of high-powered legacy members here who might have posted more in a flurry of gladness back when this forum was founded, continuing at least for a couple years. So it might make sense to follow trends in Legacy vs. New users if that's possible. To illustrate, assume a Legacy user posts 2.7 times per day on average. A New user wanders in, posts for maybe a few months out of a given year, then wanders out, thus averaging maybe 0.3 posts per day. Whatever the real numbers are, at some point that difference would become statistically significant. If you graphed it, you might see clear trends among Legacy and New users' posts, which would also affect the total posts in a given year. The same aspect might make the TD stats appear more steady. There are other ways to examine whatever data is available, but surely that's more than enough for now. And... fdp: "Latin. It is where many of our languages come from." jk: "Entomology is an endlessly fascinating subject, particularly moths and beetles." Thank you both for that very humorous joint reference! [optimus verbum ludus diei] Cheers, Mr. Kard ( Verbum vermis)
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