daytona
Grommet
I’d like to help you son but you’re too young to vote
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Favorite Album: Love You/Per Sounds
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Post by daytona on Jan 10, 2024 15:01:51 GMT -5
Can we all just appreciate how good this song is? It feels like one of the few actually passionate moments on 15BO, and Brian’s like, really into it; you can hear him smiling as he sings it.
Also relevant is this stunning version:
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petsite
Author/Historian/ Researcher
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Post by petsite on Jan 10, 2024 15:21:09 GMT -5
Can we all just appreciate how good this song is? It feels like one of the few actually passionate moments on 15BO, and Brian’s like, really into it; you can hear him smiling as he sings it. Also relevant is this stunning version: This version made the rounds after 1976 as one that a lot of us wanted. Was so happy when this show finally go released on home video.
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Post by ian on Jan 10, 2024 15:22:53 GMT -5
Well…I agree he got a bit fired up performing it but I personally don’t think it’s that brilliant. The lyrics are pretty lame and the 1976 vocal is a far cry from Brian’s best
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Post by John Manning on Jan 10, 2024 15:25:28 GMT -5
Can we all just appreciate how good this song is? It feels like one of the few actually passionate moments on 15BO, and Brian’s like, really into it; you can hear him smiling as he sings it. Also relevant is this stunning version: Glorious! Brian’s digging that to the max – awkward mannerisms in there that he still had when touring in recent years but you sense his and the rest of the band’s joy – and good to see Billy H hiding among the choir. What was recorded first – this or POB’s River Song? Both make great use of the same choir. And that pianist… gets a tune out of the piano without even touching the keys! (Which suggests to me that there might be other takes of this on tape)
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daytona
Grommet
I’d like to help you son but you’re too young to vote
Posts: 39
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Favorite Album: Love You/Per Sounds
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Post by daytona on Jan 10, 2024 15:27:06 GMT -5
Can we all just appreciate how good this song is? It feels like one of the few actually passionate moments on 15BO, and Brian’s like, really into it; you can hear him smiling as he sings it. Also relevant is this stunning version: Glorious! Brian’s digging that to the max – awkward mannerisms in there that he still had when touring in recent years but you sense his and the rest of the band’s joy – and good to see Billy H hiding among the choir. What was recorded first – this or POB’s River Song? Both make great use of the same choir. And that pianist… gets a tune out of the piano without even touching the keys! (Which suggests to me that there might be other takes of this on tape) Wasn’t River Song kicking around all the way back in ‘74? I’ll have to recheck Bellagio.
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daytona
Grommet
I’d like to help you son but you’re too young to vote
Posts: 39
Likes: 30
Favorite Album: Love You/Per Sounds
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Post by daytona on Jan 10, 2024 15:28:15 GMT -5
Well…I agree he got a bit fired up performing it but I personally don’t think it’s that brilliant. The lyrics are pretty lame and the 1976 vocal is a far cry from Brian’s best No more “lame” than anything on Love You, in fact it may even have slightly more weight than that album’s lyrics…
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petsite
Author/Historian/ Researcher
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Post by petsite on Jan 10, 2024 15:41:19 GMT -5
That scene is a moment of joy in that special. Every one is enjoying themselves. And the choir is so phenomenal.
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Post by Mikie on Jan 10, 2024 17:28:30 GMT -5
I've always loved that entire "It's OK" video, ever since I first watched it on TV in '76. This segment is one of the all-time parts of the movie as far as I'm concerned. Do you see Billy Hinsche there in the Double Rock choir?
I love this rehearsal too from the "It's OK" special. Carl, with Billy doing Brian's high part:
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patsy6
Dude/Dudette
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Post by patsy6 on Jan 10, 2024 17:43:49 GMT -5
Can we all just appreciate how good this song is? It feels like one of the few actually passionate moments on 15BO, and Brian’s like, really into it; you can hear him smiling as he sings it. Also relevant is this stunning version: I absolutely love this version of That Same Song. In fact, there have been a few times recently when I've played it on YouTube when I've been depressed, and it has helped to pull me out of it. Brian can be very inspiring in that way. In the case of this particular session, the whole is definitely greater than the sum of its parts.
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Post by drbeachboy (Dirk) on Jan 10, 2024 17:43:56 GMT -5
Well…I agree he got a bit fired up performing it but I personally don’t think it’s that brilliant. The lyrics are pretty lame and the 1976 vocal is a far cry from Brian’s best I’ll take Brian’s mid to late-70’s vocal voicings over anything that came after.
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Post by Mikie on Jan 10, 2024 18:12:19 GMT -5
And that choir!! The Double Rock Baptist Voices Of Inspiration Choir from Compton California, lead by Alexander Hamilton on piano. Same choir that did backup vocals on "River Song" and "Pacific Ocean Blues" on Dennis' POB album. Fantastico!
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Post by John Manning on Jan 10, 2024 18:37:21 GMT -5
Glorious! Brian’s digging that to the max – awkward mannerisms in there that he still had when touring in recent years but you sense his and the rest of the band’s joy – and good to see Billy H hiding among the choir. What was recorded first – this or POB’s River Song? Both make great use of the same choir. And that pianist… gets a tune out of the piano without even touching the keys! (Which suggests to me that there might be other takes of this on tape) Wasn’t River Song kicking around all the way back in ‘74? I’ll have to recheck Bellagio. Aye, I believe the BBs cut a version pre-POB (or was it Dennis, working on it as a track for The Beach Boys?) but it was unfinished – at least, going by the booted version; don't think the gospel choir was added to that, and I don't think it was the same instrumental track that appeared on POB.
Too late at night now to be heading to Bellagio, time for bed!
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Post by bessieboporbach on Jan 10, 2024 18:43:07 GMT -5
Well…I agree he got a bit fired up performing it but I personally don’t think it’s that brilliant. The lyrics are pretty lame and the 1976 vocal is a far cry from Brian’s best No more “lame” than anything on Love You, in fact it may even have slightly more weight than that album’s lyrics… I must confess, I am fairly new to this forum, but the frequent belittling remarks and generally dismissive attitude toward Love You that I've seen here comes as a surprise. I thought it was generally considered a certain type of highlight for the band musically (I've certainly always considered it that), and the words are so unguardedly weird and starkly emotional that I can't imagine anyone finding fault with them. "That Same Song" is in a similar vein, like "Had to Phone Ya" in a way, but to me the effort to make a Big Statement About Music on "That Same Song" really falls on its face. It's kind of a repeat of "Add Some Music" but that song made more of an effort to connect the meaning to universal experiences and is much more touching as a result, to me anyway. "Do You Remember" is another comparable song but that one had a clearer sense of purpose -- it was trying to educate younger teen fans about the music that had inspired Brian and particularly Mike, and it did that in a fun and musically creative way. I certainly don't think "That Same Song" has any more to say than something like "Airplane" or "Johnny Carson." One thing's for sure, though: it's a hell of a lot better than "Slightly American Music." Brian's I Love Music/History of Music songs arguably just kept getting worse after the peak of "Add Some Music."
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daytona
Grommet
I’d like to help you son but you’re too young to vote
Posts: 39
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Favorite Album: Love You/Per Sounds
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Post by daytona on Jan 10, 2024 18:43:57 GMT -5
Wasn’t River Song kicking around all the way back in ‘74? I’ll have to recheck Bellagio. Aye, I believe the BBs cut a version pre-POB (or was it Dennis, working on it as a track for The Beach Boys?) but it was unfinished – at least, going by the booted version; don't think the gospel choir was added to that, and I don't think it was the same instrumental track that appeared on POB.
Too late at night now to be heading to Bellagio, time for bed!
Actually it was even earlier, Bellagio says there was a session for it in late 1973!
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Post by Rick Bartlett on Jan 10, 2024 18:58:57 GMT -5
It's a great little number, I dig it a lot! Would have been great to have it in the setlist once in a while over the years as a surprise. I feel the same way about 'Back Home' though too....
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Post by Mikie on Jan 10, 2024 19:33:45 GMT -5
Wasn’t River Song kicking around all the way back in ‘74? I’ll have to recheck Bellagio. Aye, I believe the BBs cut a version pre-POB (or was it Dennis, working on it as a track for The Beach Boys?) but it was unfinished – at least, going by the booted version; don't think the gospel choir was added to that, and I don't think it was the same instrumental track that appeared on POB.
Too late at night now to be heading to Bellagio, time for bed!
Per C-man - RIVER SONG - PRODUCED BY DENNIS WILSON (1973/1974) / DENNIS WILSON and GREGG JAKOBSON (1976) (Edits are mine). Recorded at Brother Studio, Santa Monica, CA, circa late 1973/early 1974 Tape transfer made & final lead vocal recorded at Brother Studio, Santa Monica, CA, circa second week of March 1976 Strings recorded at Brother Studio, Santa Monica, CA, Wednesday July 7, 1976 Choir and lead vocal in bridge recorded at Brother Studio, Santa Monica, CA, circa Saturday July 10, 1976 Mixed at Brother Studio, Santa Monica, CA, Tuesday March 22, 1977 The Beach Boys performed an early version of the song live at a few concerts in 1973, with Blondie Chaplin singing lead and playing a biting guitar solo over the end. Later, Dennis added the music for the song's bridge, and late that year KABC-TV in Los Angeles ran a short feature on the band which showed them running through the "River Song" track in the studio, in preparation for a recording session. Tapes circulate of two summer '73 gigs that include the live "River Song", as well as audio from the KABC broadcast. In early '74 or so, Dennis laid down the final basic track for the song, featuring Ricky Fataar on drums, Carl and Billy Hinsche on guitars, Ed Carter on bass, and himself on piano. Dennis also recorded a rough lead vocal, but the bridge section still didn't have lyrics. A 1974 rough mix of this track, produced by Dennis' photographer friend Ed Roach, circulates on bootlegs: it includes other instruments (like timbales & cowbell) that are not audible on the POB mix. As Jon Stebbins puts it, "Dennis had been fine-tuning it for so long that it had taken on epic dimensions; overdub after overdub was added then stripped then layered on again until it was right. The result is astonishing. Dennis, supported by Carl, leads us into the maze with a familiar harmony appetizer, then he takes over in a Ray Charles/Joe Cocker style and burns up the grooves. A full-choir backing ranges from lilting whisper to gospel wailing. Driving, distorted guitar and Dennis' tinkling piano send the number to its riveting climax." A 20-piece string section were added to give the song a brooding undercurrent; and finally, at least 35 members of the 75-strong Voices Of Inspiration Choir from the Double Rock Baptist Church in Compton, under the direction of Alexander Hamilton, were allowed to soar over the track, making a surprising entrance in the intro, then weaving in and out of the piano riffs and string crescendos for the remainder of the song. Looking at Bellagio 10452, I see that "That same Song" was recorded in April 1976 during the midst of recording songs for the "Pacific Ocean Blue" album at Brother Studio in Santa Monica. So the choir was already known to Dennis prior to bringing them in to record the River Song in July.
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daytona
Grommet
I’d like to help you son but you’re too young to vote
Posts: 39
Likes: 30
Favorite Album: Love You/Per Sounds
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Post by daytona on Jan 10, 2024 19:42:50 GMT -5
Aye, I believe the BBs cut a version pre-POB (or was it Dennis, working on it as a track for The Beach Boys?) but it was unfinished – at least, going by the booted version; don't think the gospel choir was added to that, and I don't think it was the same instrumental track that appeared on POB.
Too late at night now to be heading to Bellagio, time for bed!
Per C-man - RIVER SONG - PRODUCED BY DENNIS WILSON (1973/1974) / DENNIS WILSON and GREGG JAKOBSON (1976) (Edits are mine). Recorded at Brother Studio, Santa Monica, CA, circa late 1973/early 1974 Tape transfer made & final lead vocal recorded at Brother Studio, Santa Monica, CA, circa second week of March 1976 Strings recorded at Brother Studio, Santa Monica, CA, Wednesday July 7, 1976 Choir and lead vocal in bridge recorded at Brother Studio, Santa Monica, CA, circa Saturday July 10, 1976 Mixed at Brother Studio, Santa Monica, CA, Tuesday March 22, 1977 The Beach Boys performed an early version of the song live at a few concerts in 1973, with Blondie Chaplin singing lead and playing a biting guitar solo over the end. Later, Dennis added the music for the song's bridge, and late that year KABC-TV in Los Angeles ran a short feature on the band which showed them running through the "River Song" track in the studio, in preparation for a recording session. Tapes circulate of two summer '73 gigs that include the live "River Song", as well as audio from the KABC broadcast. In early '74 or so, Dennis laid down the final basic track for the song, featuring Ricky Fataar on drums, Carl and Billy Hinsche on guitars, Ed Carter on bass, and himself on piano. Dennis also recorded a rough lead vocal, but the bridge section still didn't have lyrics. A 1974 rough mix of this track, produced by Dennis' photographer friend Ed Roach, circulates on bootlegs: it includes other instruments (like timbales & cowbell) that are not audible on the POB mix. As Jon Stebbins puts it, "Dennis had been fine-tuning it for so long that it had taken on epic dimensions; overdub after overdub was added then stripped then layered on again until it was right. The result is astonishing. Dennis, supported by Carl, leads us into the maze with a familiar harmony appetizer, then he takes over in a Ray Charles/Joe Cocker style and burns up the grooves. A full-choir backing ranges from lilting whisper to gospel wailing. Driving, distorted guitar and Dennis' tinkling piano send the number to its riveting climax." A 20-piece string section were added to give the song a brooding undercurrent; and finally, at least 35 members of the 75-strong Voices Of Inspiration Choir from the Double Rock Baptist Church in Compton, under the direction of Alexander Hamilton, were allowed to soar over the track, making a surprising entrance in the intro, then weaving in and out of the piano riffs and string crescendos for the remainder of the song. Whoa, didn’t know Craig had a Dennis sessionography. it’d be interesting to hear these spoken of bootlegs with the track on them.
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brian65
Grommet
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Post by brian65 on Jan 10, 2024 20:14:27 GMT -5
Two detailed Webpages breaking down the history and Sessions on Craig's wonderful Website!
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Post by Emdeeh on Jan 10, 2024 21:19:11 GMT -5
... the frequent belittling remarks and generally dismissive attitude toward Love You that I've seen here comes as a surprise. I thought it was generally considered a certain type of highlight for the band musically (I've certainly always considered it that), and the words are so unguardedly weird and starkly emotional that I can't imagine anyone finding fault with them. I don't know about anyone else, but I still feel that Love You represents a nadir of their career, esp. lyrically and vocally. My experience is that people either love LY or hate it, but there's not a lot of middle ground on that album.
On the other hand, I do find "That Same Song" to be enjoyable, especially in the video posted at the beginning of this thread.
Your mileage may vary, and probably does.
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Post by drbeachboy (Dirk) on Jan 10, 2024 21:28:20 GMT -5
... the frequent belittling remarks and generally dismissive attitude toward Love You that I've seen here comes as a surprise. I thought it was generally considered a certain type of highlight for the band musically (I've certainly always considered it that), and the words are so unguardedly weird and starkly emotional that I can't imagine anyone finding fault with them. I don't know about anyone else, but I still feel that Love You represents a nadir of their career, esp. lyrically and vocally. My experience is that people either love LY or hate it, but there's not a lot of middle ground on that album.
On the other hand, I do find "That Same Song" to be enjoyable, especially in the video posted at the beginning of this thread.
Your mileage may vary, and probably does.
I have always looked at Love You as the one off, edgy, rough sounding New Wave-ish type album. You could almost see this coming with some of the vocals on 15 Big Ones.
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Post by E on Jan 11, 2024 4:29:40 GMT -5
I enjoy the version in the video, with (Billy Hinsche appearing twice!); I like the choir and the energy, but the lyrics don't do much for me. The album version seems a little flat after watching this.
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Post by AGD on Jan 11, 2024 5:15:14 GMT -5
Aye, I believe the BBs cut a version pre-POB (or was it Dennis, working on it as a track for The Beach Boys?) but it was unfinished – at least, going by the booted version; don't think the gospel choir was added to that, and I don't think it was the same instrumental track that appeared on POB.
Too late at night now to be heading to Bellagio, time for bed!
Per C-man - RIVER SONG - PRODUCED BY DENNIS WILSON (1973/1974) / DENNIS WILSON and GREGG JAKOBSON (1976) (Edits are mine). Recorded at Brother Studio, Santa Monica, CA, circa late 1973/early 1974 Tape transfer made & final lead vocal recorded at Brother Studio, Santa Monica, CA, circa second week of March 1976 Strings recorded at Brother Studio, Santa Monica, CA, Wednesday July 7, 1976 Choir and lead vocal in bridge recorded at Brother Studio, Santa Monica, CA, circa Saturday July 10, 1976 Mixed at Brother Studio, Santa Monica, CA, Tuesday March 22, 1977 The Beach Boys performed an early version of the song live at a few concerts in 1973, with Blondie Chaplin singing lead and playing a biting guitar solo over the end. Later, Dennis added the music for the song's bridge, and late that year KABC-TV in Los Angeles ran a short feature on the band which showed them running through the "River Song" track in the studio, in preparation for a recording session. Tapes circulate of two summer '73 gigs that include the live "River Song", as well as audio from the KABC broadcast. In early '74 or so, Dennis laid down the final basic track for the song, featuring Ricky Fataar on drums, Carl and Billy Hinsche on guitars, Ed Carter on bass, and himself on piano. Dennis also recorded a rough lead vocal, but the bridge section still didn't have lyrics. A 1974 rough mix of this track, produced by Dennis' photographer friend Ed Roach, circulates on bootlegs: it includes other instruments (like timbales & cowbell) that are not audible on the POB mix. As Jon Stebbins puts it, "Dennis had been fine-tuning it for so long that it had taken on epic dimensions; overdub after overdub was added then stripped then layered on again until it was right. The result is astonishing. Dennis, supported by Carl, leads us into the maze with a familiar harmony appetizer, then he takes over in a Ray Charles/Joe Cocker style and burns up the grooves. A full-choir backing ranges from lilting whisper to gospel wailing. Driving, distorted guitar and Dennis' tinkling piano send the number to its riveting climax." A 20-piece string section were added to give the song a brooding undercurrent; and finally, at least 35 members of the 75-strong Voices Of Inspiration Choir from the Double Rock Baptist Church in Compton, under the direction of Alexander Hamilton, were allowed to soar over the track, making a surprising entrance in the intro, then weaving in and out of the piano riffs and string crescendos for the remainder of the song. Looking at Bellagio 10452, I see that "That same Song" was recorded in April 1976 during the midst of recording songs for the "Pacific Ocean Blue" album at Brother Studio in Santa Monica. So the choir was already known to Dennis prior to bringing them in to record the River Song in July. That didn't ring any bells, so I checked: the version on 15BO was recorded October 1975. Possible overdubs in May next year.
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Post by jk on Jan 11, 2024 5:57:55 GMT -5
I have always looked at Love You as the one off, edgy, rough sounding New Wave-ish type album. You could almost see this coming with some of the vocals on 15 Big Ones.Yes. In that way, it was a logical next step, although where could you go from there? As for Love You's New Wave connection, parts of it remind me of Lindsey Buckingham's New-Wavier contributions to Tusk:
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Departed
Former Member
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Post by Deleted on Jan 11, 2024 9:36:48 GMT -5
I don't see anything new wave in Love You. Brian had been working with synthesizers for a a few years. What he was doing with them in LY was not that much of a departure from his previous work (bass lines, counter melodies). And his arrangements hadn't diverged all that much from how he normally worked. The most Love You sounding tracks on Love You were worked up by Brian and Earle Mankey. The big percussion sounds were an Earle feature. He liked liked big sounds and things that popped out at you in a mix. He was very influenced by Tony Visonti's approach to making things sound big - he specifically mentioned T-Rex to me and pointed out an example of how Tony got big sounding sounds. Earle also used muting (and/or soloing) (much like how hip hop producers would come to use it) as a tool for bringing sounds into relief and making them seem bigger than they actually are (think the short turnaround tom break in Let Us Go On This Way).
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Post by bessieboporbach on Jan 11, 2024 10:07:39 GMT -5
... the frequent belittling remarks and generally dismissive attitude toward Love You that I've seen here comes as a surprise. I thought it was generally considered a certain type of highlight for the band musically (I've certainly always considered it that), and the words are so unguardedly weird and starkly emotional that I can't imagine anyone finding fault with them. I don't know about anyone else, but I still feel that Love You represents a nadir of their career, esp. lyrically and vocally. My experience is that people either love LY or hate it, but there's not a lot of middle ground on that album.
On the other hand, I do find "That Same Song" to be enjoyable, especially in the video posted at the beginning of this thread.
Your mileage may vary, and probably does.
I guess I'm in the "love it" camp, because when I started exploring the Beach Boys discography about 25 years ago, it struck me immediately as far more musically creative and... interesting than almost anything else they did in the '70s. The only stuff that I thought was in the same league was Sunflower and Pacific Ocean Blue. By comparison to Love You I thought Carl & the Passions and 15 Big Ones in particular were awful. In retrospect I like those records better now (particularly 15 Big Ones) but I still think of Love You as a career highlight for Brian.
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