BeachBoysTalk Topic - Golden era 63-66?

But what are 'mental health issues' in relation to the creative decisions being made in that period, and why does it matter? There was a big, marked move away from competitive music to non-competitive music out of self-preservation. That's one thing; the motivation for the entire game moved because the old working environment was damaging to Brian's mental health. It's inarguably significant. But inside of that... what's different? "Don't try, can't fail" is commerciality and reputation, not quality. Mental illness isn't telling Brian how to instruct the drum pattern on Transcendental Meditation, or deciding which take of "poof" is the one. He was making music at the same level that he'd always made music. Growing, even. Friends is an absolute maturation musically of what had come before.

There's no lessening of ability on the balance of mental health - just new choices made under the blanket of a large change to the status quo. It's freedom, I think. When mental illness had a legitimate impact on Brian's music is when it stopped him from being able to actually go into a studio and create that music.

I don't think it's even as big a shift to Brian's modus operandi as we're making it out to be. There's a valid argument to be made that the way Brian approached the Beach Boys as a vehicle for his art was comparably different between 1963 and 1964.

I didn't make a comment about "how much of it is Brian" as he was still absolutely the leader and producer, as I said. Smiley Smile, for example, is absolutely Brian's album, but I certainly wouldn't say that he put 100% effort into the production as he had until recently.

I think so many of the decisions made regarding song choices, arrangements and musicians (or lack of musicians) speak to that.

Of course, that doesn't mean that when recording started that he didn't try within that framework. You would expect him to be fully in charge of the session tapes, but that doesn't mean that the whole structure of recording wasn't at all influenced by his mental health issues.

I would say that it absolutely was, but other people are perfectly entitled to have their opinion on that.

You are right that we should agree to disagree. I think it was David Leaf made the point that the number of musicians used was significantly smaller than during the early years, but of course there were many other differences.

Thanks for always keeping the discussion civil at any rate. 

Was Bach putting in less effort writing the Cello Suites than the Polyphic Spree did when writing Light and Day?  It's just not a relevant metric.

To me it seems, especially with Smiley, he was doing the same work in half (quarter?) the time because of the home studio. Same amount of sessions (or more) without as much of the down time between. Probably.

Sometimes less is more.....difficult.

Well, I didn't say that and that is turning what I did say on its head. 

Smiley Smile was all Brian in terms of the production and it absolutely reflects the person he was at that time. I don't think anyone has or would argue otherwise.

It isn't imo him working with 100% intensity as he had earlier and, irrespective of the number of sessions, that is the big difference for me and it's the one that several people involved at the time have talked about.

Whether it is the music that Brian wanted to make becomes a little murky with songs like Heroes and Villains, Wonderful, Wind Chimes etc. of course, simply because they were originally intended to be so different. The versions that he "wanted to make" changed within the space of a few weeks which again shows the impact of his mentality at the time.


 

I think Matt's humbly taken on board the correction re Brian's production involvement for Smiley/WH/Friends.

However, I tend to agree with Matt's broader opinion about the end results of these productions and the approach Brian took; in terms of the sonic picture which was a radical change from 63-67 period where Brian raised a very high board.

While Brian's "less is more approach" to the sound was deliberate post Smile, it doesn't necessarily mean for all listeners it was as successful as the earlier period, and definitely draws a line between "eras".

Perhaps this can be attributed to the change in room sound (reduced Western or Goldstar usage, and more home, Heiders and ID Sound) and transition from Chuck to Jim Lockert and the emergence of Steve Desper as a contributor a gradual reinvention of sound finally realised cohesively on Sunflower. 

Little unfair to imply any of us defending the validity of that music and Brian's involvement in it are "drawing a line between the enlightened and the unwashed", rather than simply being passionate about a topic that's so often in the past been misrepresented to fit a particular contortion of history, but yeah, absolutely. The more open to understanding and enjoying it for what it is the better.

The Golden Era of The Beach Boys began with the June 1962 release of "Surfin' Safari"/"409" and ended five years later with the July 1967 release of "Heroes and Villains"/"You're Welcome". It was an era when art and commerce meshed seamlessly for the group - two factors that would never quite be in sync again.



The timeframe of SMILEY SMILE thru HOLLAND certainly extended the band's creativity along more democratic lines. It was a period to be proud of, perhaps even more so retrospectively, but I could not exactly call it a "Golden Age", even as The Beach Boys continued to make highly competent and idiosyncratic pop music.

As we pursue fairness, let's be fair to the saltiest of all Marshmallows here -- he didn't say "people who don’t necessarily take away the same nuance and detail of musical production 'don’t get Brian Wilson'"

What he said was:

"It shouldn't be possible to listen to Be Here in the Mornin', or Aren't You Glad, or Little Bird, and come away thinking that's a guy musically operating at anything less than 105%. If you do, I don't think you're getting Brian Wilson."


It's not really about what we are taking away as listeners, which is of course completely subjective.  I think what he is after, and certainly what I am after, is correcting the anecdotal, myth-based narrative that we have accreted over the decades by countering that with an objective, factual narrative that is based on empirical observations of the historical record.  One can select from the entire spectrum of human reactions when confronted with the music, but there have been a lot of new facts emerging as the archival releases have come out and we continue to find primary sources, and as we use what we learn there to take a new look at the mechanics behind the music -- which admittedly is not as interesting to some people as it is to others.  The facts here are that to observe Brian's work, including a quantitative evaluation as well as a simple observation of his methods reveals a man who was working very hard.  He was holding tons of recording sessions, he was writing songs, he was collaborating, he was running tracking and vocal sessions, he was arranging, he was playing, he was singing...for Friends he was booking dozens and dozens of outside musicians.  And rather than recycle his arrangement and production ideas from before, he instead was working to develop new ones.  And like I said above, his work in this regard paid off because he got better at idiomatically exploiting the tools he selected to produce his music.  You can hate the music or love it, but this development is obvious.  And I think that's what Salty means here -- if you can't see that Brian is going gangbusters, you maybe aren't looking hard enough, because the record shows that he was hard at work.  And acknowledging that is really critical to a factually true and historically valuable record.  

As I stated on Beach Boys Talk, the 'Golden Age Of The Beach Boys' is 1962-1973.