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Post by mattbbtalk on Jun 8, 2021 21:58:22 GMT -5
I recently realized that Bruce is not enshrined with the rest of the BB at the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame. I was actually surprised by this. The question is, should he be there?
I say yes. Though he is not an original member, he stepped in at a crucial moment. He taught himself how to play bass and sang Brian's parts on top of those complex harmonies. Later on down the line he wrote some very nice songs for the BB, and he won his own grammy for "I write the songs". Joel Selvin on one of our episodes pointed out that Bruce was a successful producer even before his BB days.
Why is he not included? Am I overstating Bruce's importance to the Beach Boys? I sometimes hear him maligned, but I think he entered a difficult situation, and in his own way, helped to keep the BB name alive through his songs and productions. He produced the Light Album and KTSA. He is also heard on some of the most iconic BB songs in crucial parts such as "California Girls", "The Little Girl I Once Knew", and the timeless "God Only Knows". Brian loved his voice.
He still tours with them to this day, and can still provide some nice vocals. He always deferred to Brian and Mike. To me he seems very gracious. I hope that the Rock Hall will reconsider and add Bruce with the other Beach Boys.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 8, 2021 22:04:27 GMT -5
I agree with you but I have a question. How do we determine which individual members are included in the Hall of fame. Was Bruce invited to the Hall of fame event? Is there an official designation of which band members are included? is David marks in the Hall of fame as a beach boy? Consider the band Yes for example. Which of its many members are formerly designated as members of the Hall of fame? The same of The Rolling Stones? Which of the members are officially in as members of The Rolling Stones? Is Mick Taylor included in that group? If someone knows please send a link to the hall of fame where they specifically designate which members in which bands are included when a named band is elected to the Hall of fame. A really good question.
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Post by mattbbtalk on Jun 8, 2021 22:18:34 GMT -5
That is a great question! I do not have an answer. I do know that originally it was a technicality because the group has to be together for 25 years after their first album, and Bruce came later. But I am not sure why he is being snubbed now. But your question is excellent and I hope someone will answer here!
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Post by Deleted on Jun 8, 2021 22:26:52 GMT -5
I agree with you but I have a question. How do we determine which individual members are included in the Hall of fame. Was Bruce invited to the Hall of fame event? Is there an official designation of which band members are included? is David marks in the Hall of fame as a beach boy? Consider the band Yes for example. Which of its many members are formerly designated as members of the Hall of fame? The same of The Rolling Stones? Which of the members are officially in as members of The Rolling Stones? Is Mick Taylor included in that group? If someone knows please send a link to the hall of fame where they specifically designate which members in which bands are included when a named band is elected to the Hall of fame. A really good question. According to this I think Taylor is, www.rockhall.com/inductees/rolling-stonesWhich begs the question I asked earlier on the stream.. Should Blondie Chaplin and Ricky Fataar be inducted as Beach Boys? If Taylor made it as a Rolling Stone then those 2 should surely make it as Beach Boys? They offered up more to the Boys even making the music edgier.And I see by the solo artists on this board they are both there. And Bruce should definitely be in there. |
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Post by Deleted on Jun 8, 2021 22:35:40 GMT -5
On the link I posted above, 1st I searched The Beach Boys, The usual 5 are inducted, then I searched David Marks, nothing showed up.Same for Bruce...
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Post by mattbbtalk on Jun 8, 2021 22:36:28 GMT -5
Thanks Stevie! That is an interesting question. I feel like the whole Beach Boys organization should be in the Hall of Fame. They could not have performed live with such authenticity without all the extra members! Additionally, Blondie and Ricki were on albums, wrote songs, and performed live. They are Beach Boys!
I read the situation with David was rectified, but I could not find anything either when I researched it.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 8, 2021 23:06:09 GMT -5
Thanks Stevie! That is an interesting question. I feel like the whole Beach Boys organization should be in the Hall of Fame. They could not have performed live with such authenticity without all the extra members! Additionally, Blondie and Ricki were on albums, wrote songs, and performed live. They are Beach Boys! I read the situation with David was rectified, but I could not find anything either when I researched it. Just came across this, maybe you've seen it.. Quite strange that they can't change a rule. Jon Stebbins 07/29/12 "I don't think the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame is allowed to change the official induction status of an act because of their own technical rules. Therefore, David's original 1988 snub when the BB's were inducted remains intact. However, in 2007, the Hall was nice enough to acknowledge David's importance to the BB's history and invited him there for a special day and speaking engagement. They do sell our book in the gift shop, and David is included in the Beach Boys display in the museum. In essence they have done what they can to make up for the oversight, short of changing their own rules." |
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Post by mattbbtalk on Jun 8, 2021 23:11:31 GMT -5
Thanks for the information! It is too bad. Both David and Bruce deserve the honor!
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Post by ian on Jun 9, 2021 6:09:12 GMT -5
By the way-Bruce was at the 1988 ceremonies and is visible in the footage of the jam session that night-when Barbara Ann, satisfaction, stand by me, I saw her standing there and like a rollling stone amongst others were played
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Post by Autotune on Jun 9, 2021 7:45:49 GMT -5
In typical BB fashion, they get inducted and not only an awkward speech was delivered but they’re represented in the jam session by a 1961 doo-wop number.
Regarding Bruce, IMO he is Hall of Fame material. Certain fans love to hate non-Wilson beach boys (Blondie and Ricky get a pass), but not only was he an integral part of the group, but a California surf rock/pop pioneer. So many guys were inducted in the RRHOF based on the work they did in their teens, 20s and 30s, and Bruce’s work at that time of his life is extremely impressive as a recording artist, musician and producer. I say put him in!
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Post by mattbbtalk on Jun 9, 2021 8:11:11 GMT -5
By the way-Bruce was at the 1988 ceremonies and is visible in the footage of the jam session that night-when Barbara Ann, satisfaction, stand by me, I saw her standing there and like a rollling stone amongst others were played Thanks Ian! It’s interesting that Bruce was there but not honored with the test of the band members. But I am glad that he was at the jam session with them. On another note, they are playing a song for their induction and they play Barbara Ann? Probably not the best choice. |
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Post by mattbbtalk on Jun 9, 2021 8:12:37 GMT -5
In typical BB fashion, they get inducted and not only an awkward speech was delivered but they’re represented in the jam session by a 1961 doo-wop number. Regarding Bruce, IMO he is Hall of Fame material. Certain fans love to hate non-Wilson beach boys (Blondie and Ricky get a pass), but not only was he an integral part of the group, but a California surf rock/pop pioneer. So many guys were inducted in the RRHOF based on the work they did in their teens, 20s and 30s, and Bruce’s work at that time of his life is extremely impressive as a recording artist, musician and producer. I say put him in! Yes great point. Of all the songs they could have played from their expansive and impressive catalogue..... Totally agree with you about Bruce! |
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Post by Shawn on Jun 9, 2021 12:03:32 GMT -5
While I strongly agree that both Bruce and David should be in as part of The Beach Boys (R&R Hall rules notwithstanding), for others it may come down to contractual status within the band itself. For example, even though Ron Wood joined The Rolling Stones in 1975, he didn’t ‘officially’ become a member until 1993; until that point contractually he was a hired gun, so-to-speak.
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Post by Emdeeh on Jun 9, 2021 14:03:30 GMT -5
By sheer happenstance, I wound up being the fan who told Bruce, Al, and Mike that the Beach Boys were being inducted into the Rock 'n' Hall of Fame. I heard about their induction on a TV show the night before, and was very surprised that they'd not already been informed.
Anyway, I've always thought that Bruce and David should have been inducted in 1988 and that Blondie and Ricky should be inducted as well, even if their tenures were shorter. They are / were all principals -- official Beach Boys.
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Post by mattbbtalk on Jun 9, 2021 14:26:56 GMT -5
By sheer happenstance, I wound up being the fan who told Bruce, Al, and Mike that the Beach Boys were being inducted into the Rock 'n' Hall of Fame. I heard about their induction on a TV show the night before, and was very surprised that they'd not already been informed. Anyway, I've always thought that Bruce and David should have been inducted in 1988 and that Blondie and Ricky should be inducted as well, even if their tenures were shorter. They are / were all principals -- official Beach Boys. Wow that’s awesome!! I agree with your point. They were all official Beach Boys, and they all contributed positively in some way. |
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Post by mattbbtalk on Jun 9, 2021 14:27:47 GMT -5
While I strongly agree that both Bruce and David should be in as part of The Beach Boys (R&R Hall rules notwithstanding), for others it may come down to contractual status within the band itself. For example, even though Ron Wood joined The Rolling Stones in 1975, he didn’t ‘officially’ become a member until 1993; until that point contractually he was a hired gun, so-to-speak. Great point. I think that was originally the issue with the Bruce, but surely he has been in the band long enough by now. Who knows! |
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Post by ian on Jun 9, 2021 16:58:28 GMT -5
Not sure the BBs picked it-all that footage is on YouTube and if you look at it-you see that Paul Shaffer was acting as bandleader and kind of calling out tunes to the assembled musicians
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Post by ian on Jun 9, 2021 17:01:06 GMT -5
You can also spot Brian at the 1987 induction jam-for example when they played pretty woman by Roy Orbison
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Post by Moon Dawg on Jun 9, 2021 18:11:30 GMT -5
Indeed he is. Bruce was in the band 1965-72, a long period that encompasses much of their best work. He wrote several songs, one of which is an American classic. (Guess which one.) An able vocalist and musician. Solid member again with various configurations 1978 - present.
Mick Taylor and Ron Wood are in w/ the Stones. Bruce deserves the same w/ the Beach Boys.
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Post by E on Jun 10, 2021 1:06:03 GMT -5
And Bruce has now been 'in the band' longer than anyone except Mike...
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Post by Vale on Jun 10, 2021 2:32:26 GMT -5
I think Bruce should be there, he deserve it
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Post by George Faulkner on Jun 10, 2021 7:54:51 GMT -5
I have heard there are two common bumps in becoming a part of the R&RHoF. 1) The core band members get to decide who to invite, then 2) someone has to pay for each inductee. So, if you are chosen to be invited, it's like $25k or something that someone has to pay for each inductee. Many times, secondary members are invited, but don't feel like coughing up the cash.
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Post by Al S on Jun 10, 2021 8:02:36 GMT -5
I have heard there are two common bumps in becoming a part of the R&RHoF. 1) The core band members get to decide who to invite, then 2) someone has to pay for each inductee. So, if you are chosen to be invited, it's like $25k or something that someone has to pay for each inductee. Many times, secondary members are invited, but don't feel like coughing up the cash. Ah, now this is interesting - I've wondered what are the criteria in terms of how The Beach Boys organisation of the day would have defined their members, ie, who was a "fully fledged BB" with voting rights etc, versus who was a gun for hire, fair weather friend or member of the touring entity. But if there's a $ amount per inductee fee imposed by the governing body, sounds tantamount to buying a Doctorate. And $25K can buy an artist a lot of other things in the fickle world of gig by gig! |
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Post by Vale on Jun 10, 2021 8:13:09 GMT -5
I have heard there are two common bumps in becoming a part of the R&RHoF. 1) The core band members get to decide who to invite, then 2) someone has to pay for each inductee. So, if you are chosen to be invited, it's like $25k or something that someone has to pay for each inductee. Many times, secondary members are invited, but don't feel like coughing up the cash. Ah, now this is interesting - I've wondered what are the criteria in terms of how The Beach Boys organisation of the day would have defined their members, ie, who was a "fully fledged BB" with voting rights etc, versus who was a gun for hire, fair weather friend or member of the touring entity. But if there's a $ amount per inductee fee imposed by the governing body, sounds tantamount to buying a Doctorate. And $25K can buy an artist a lot of other things in the fickle world of gig by gig! I'd really like to know how is structured the Beach Boys organization chart, who controls who, voting rights... all the business/legal stuff... I bet it's above than complicated! |
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Post by mattbbtalk on Jun 10, 2021 16:39:38 GMT -5
I have heard there are two common bumps in becoming a part of the R&RHoF. 1) The core band members get to decide who to invite, then 2) someone has to pay for each inductee. So, if you are chosen to be invited, it's like $25k or something that someone has to pay for each inductee. Many times, secondary members are invited, but don't feel like coughing up the cash. That is super interesting...Does that mean they did not invite Bruce? |
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