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Post by kds on Jan 17, 2019 9:05:58 GMT -5
It's the Chiefs turn, damn it! Of the teams in the final four, they have the longest drought, so I'd be fine with them winning. With Patrick Mahomes at QB, they could develop into a powerhouse in the AFC for a few years.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 17, 2019 12:30:37 GMT -5
It's the Chiefs turn, damn it! Of the teams in the final four, they have the longest drought, so I'd be fine with them winning. With Patrick Mahomes at QB, they could develop into a powerhouse in the AFC for a few years. ^^^^^^ Looks at topic title and blinks in sheer disbelief.
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Post by Will/P.P. on Jan 17, 2019 13:34:02 GMT -5
The Chiefs going to the Super Bowl is, for me. on topic.
Let's step out of TrumpWorld for awhile. Screw politics, we've got another game to play Sunday night.
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Post by dumbchops on Jan 17, 2019 20:49:38 GMT -5
I vote for the Saints to win again.
Biggest problem facing the world right now: Star Wars Episode IX
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Post by Deleted on Jan 17, 2019 21:06:44 GMT -5
This thread has become the perfect embodiment of whats a big problem facing the world. That being, anytime someone tries to have a conversation about serious issues no one wants to listen. It inevitably descends into memes, sports, celebrity gossip and other vacuous nonsense.
Not saying this to point fingers, just some food for thought.
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Post by drbeachboy (Dirk) on Jan 17, 2019 21:51:55 GMT -5
Maybe because people have to deal with PC every stinking minute of their waking lives. That maybe when they come here, they can get away from it for a few minutes. You know, it used to be that politics could be avoided if you really weren’t interested. Today however, everything is political. Everything is PC. It invades and perverts living our lives. How’s that for an explanation?
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Post by Deleted on Jan 17, 2019 23:54:34 GMT -5
Maybe because people have to deal with PC every stinking minute of their waking lives. That maybe when they come here, they can get away from it for a few minutes. You know, it used to be that politics could be avoided if you really weren’t interested. Today however, everything is political. Everything is PC. It invades and perverts living our lives. How’s that for an explanation? Okay, first of all, calm down. I was just raising a general point about how humanity and America are facing a glut of serious, even existentially threatening problems and neither the laypeople nor the people in power are properly addressing any of it. I don't want to be accused of making everything political for raising a relevant point about serious issues in a thread asking for just such a thing in the political subforum. To put it simply, I'm not the one being off topic here-- if you don't want to talk politics don't post here. This thread was for big issues, not a football circlejerk. Second, I don't see how what I said has anything to do with political correctness either. For whatever it's worth, I'm not an advocate for SJW stuff either. As I said on the PSF, Im a Left-Libertarian. I want individual rights (own guns, drug legalization, marry who you want, genderbend if you want, bodily autonomy, etc) I want decentralization of political and economic power. Yadda yadda yadda. I do not want anyone to accuse me of being PC, SJW or anything else without at least asking my positions first. Third, believe it or not I can agree with this. There's a reason why I read Leni Loud fanfics, play Super Nintendo emulators and ROM hacks, talk about music and watch TV in my spare time. Because I often don't want to bog myself down worrying about all this shit either. But sometimes you have to put your comfort aside for a minute or two to think about it, because it's important and because if nobody does it won't get solved. It's because the earlier generations didn't solve a lot of big issues like climate change that now it has to be saddled on your kids, and the clock is ticking. Anyway, yeah. If you don't want to talk about politics then either don't include a political subforum or don't personally post on it.
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Post by E on Jan 18, 2019 2:20:48 GMT -5
Anyway, yeah. If you don't want to talk about politics then either don't include a political subforum or don't personally post on it. That would be my answer. I can think of other boards that folded because of it.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 18, 2019 2:45:02 GMT -5
Anyway, yeah. If you don't want to talk about politics then either don't include a political subforum or don't personally post on it. That would be my answer. I can think of other boards that folded because of it. After my experiences with PSF I don't think anything productive comes of it, and I've seen a very ugly side in a couple of people. I think for it to work, the forum should be dedicated to politics (and hopefully, as a result, the users have a modicum of understanding and appreciation of history, political science and objective discussion even when there's disagreement over policy.) Otherwise, you get the peanut gallery--assumptions/strawman arguments (you're leftwing, therefore you must think this), broken URLs and unreliable sources, blame games and whataboutism...the list goes on. No productive discourse can happen in an atmosphere where that kind of behavior is permitted; it's one step above monkeys flinging feces. But that said, as of this moment, this forum does have a political subforum. And a user asked a very broad, unbiased, non-leading topic. Under those circumstances, I think it's disrespectful to turn the discussion they were trying to foster into an off-topic one about football. On top of that, complaining about other people wanting to discuss politics on the very subforum dedicated to that same topic is ridiculous. The entire rest of the board is open to people who apparently can't be asked to participate in this subject matter. It's the equivalent of someone complaining about how much we discuss the Beach Boys on the main forum. In that scenario, we'd all invariably ask them "then why are you here?" and rightly so.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 18, 2019 3:00:15 GMT -5
But that said, as of this moment, this forum does have a political subforum. And a user asked a very broad, unbiased, non-leading topic. Under those circumstances, I think it's disrespectful to turn the discussion they were trying to foster into an off-topic one about football. On top of that, complaining about other people wanting to discuss politics on the very subforum dedicated to that same topic is ridiculous. This. Actually, everything you've just said. The voice of reason.
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Post by filledeplage on Jan 18, 2019 9:38:53 GMT -5
Maybe because people have to deal with PC every stinking minute of their waking lives. That maybe when they come here, they can get away from it for a few minutes. You know, it used to be that politics could be avoided if you really weren’t interested. Today however, everything is political. Everything is PC. It invades and perverts living our lives. How’s that for an explanation? Okay, first of all, calm down. I was just raising a general point about how humanity and America are facing a glut of serious, even existentially threatening problems and neither the laypeople nor the people in power are properly addressing any of it. I don't want to be accused of making everything political for raising a relevant point about serious issues in a thread asking for just such a thing in the political subforum. To put it simply, I'm not the one being off topic here-- if you don't want to talk politics don't post here. This thread was for big issues, not a football circlejerk. Second, I don't see how what I said has anything to do with political correctness either. For whatever it's worth, I'm not an advocate for SJW stuff either. As I said on the PSF, Im a Left-Libertarian. I want individual rights (own guns, drug legalization, marry who you want, genderbend if you want, bodily autonomy, etc) I want decentralization of political and economic power. Yadda yadda yadda. I do not want anyone to accuse me of being PC, SJW or anything else without at least asking my positions first. Third, believe it or not I can agree with this. There's a reason why I read Leni Loud fanfics, play Super Nintendo emulators and ROM hacks, talk about music and watch TV in my spare time. Because I often don't want to bog myself down worrying about all this shit either. But sometimes you have to put your comfort aside for a minute or two to think about it, because it's important and because if nobody does it won't get solved. It's because the earlier generations didn't solve a lot of big issues like climate change that now it has to be saddled on your kids, and the clock is ticking. Anyway, yeah. If you don't want to talk about politics then either don't include a political subforum or don't personally post on it. And that looks like a moderate/liberal Republican.
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Post by The Cap'n on Jan 18, 2019 10:37:38 GMT -5
To steer this back to the thread topic without abandoning the current debate in the thread, a person could argue that making everything political--and worse, partisan or tribal--is a really big issue. Now, I wouldn't call it in contention for "biggest problems facing the world." But it is problematic (at least in the U.S.; I can't speak for other places) when even traditional escapes become political arenas. Traditionally apolitical arenas are now seemingly filled with political messaging, and are subject to political commentators' loud judgment. Entertainment can't stop commenting on politics, and politics can't stop commenting on entertainment. To use a Seinfeldian phrase, worlds are colliding. Everyone has a right to speech, of course, but it's just sad when there's no room to breathe without attacking or being attacked.
It's why my earlier post in the thread referenced the so-called Golden Rule: it would go a long way if everyone would just cut everyone some slack sometimes (and not just in the "I cut people slack [except when they do or say something I disagree with]" kind of way). If every issue is a political issue--or even a moral issue, an issue of good v. evil--then there is literally no hope for general cultural peace. And yes, obviously I know I'm guilty of this problem, too. It's easy to see the problem, but hard to do one's part in fixing it. I'm trying to be conscious of it, to hold myself accountable, and to do better. I hope you'll go easy on me when I fail. I'll try to return the favor.
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Post by filledeplage on Jan 18, 2019 10:53:00 GMT -5
To steer this back to the thread topic without abandoning the current debate in the thread, a person could argue that making everything political--and worse, partisan or tribal--is a really big issue. Now, I wouldn't call it in contention for "biggest problems facing the world." But it is problematic (at least in the U.S.; I can't speak for other places) when even traditional escapes become political arenas. Traditionally apolitical arenas are now seemingly filled with political messaging, and are subject to political commentators' loud judgment. Entertainment can't stop commenting on politics, and politics can't stop commenting on entertainment. To use a Seinfeldian phrase, worlds are colliding. Everyone has a right to speech, of course, but it's just sad when there's no room to breathe without attacking or being attacked.
It's why my earlier post in the thread referenced the so-called Golden Rule: it would go a long way if everyone would just cut everyone some slack sometimes (and not just in the "I cut people slack [except when they do or say something I disagree with]" kind of way). If every issue is a political issue--or even a moral issue, an issue of good v. evil--then there is literally no hope for general cultural peace. And yes, obviously I know I'm guilty of this problem, too. It's easy to see the problem, but hard to do one's part in fixing it. I'm trying to be conscious of it, to hold myself accountable, and to do better. I hope you'll go easy on me when I fail. I'll try to return the favor.
The worlds have collided - I agree - and those who have not paid attention - because it was easier to "let someone else do the job - while I live my life" - are now paying attention. The old "not my problem" laziness did not help. Post Vietnam Era complacency is the way I look at it. The party lines are now blurred. And, the media who are supposed to be neutral - and just report facts - are editorializing and with party preferences. People got lazy and complacent. The people in the middle (the proverbial worker bees) got ignored and disrespected. The gilets jaunes (yellow vests) in France are a prime example of the rebellion against elitist politics who want back-to-basics government, the old one who does not moralize or substitute its' judgment for "we the people." And, I use France as an example of this rebellion, because much of the Early American Government (legal) Framers "borrowed" their work to construct our Declaration of Independence (largely from Rousseau.)
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Post by kds on Jan 18, 2019 10:56:14 GMT -5
I generally don't like to post in these threads, and perhaps our football discuss should've been moved to the NFL thread, but I think one of the biggest problems facing the world is that people can't accept different views and just move on. People have lost the ability to discuss something they don't agree on in a civil manner. As a result, relatives and friends don't speak to each other. Heck, it's one of the reasons that the BB online fanbase needs separate forums.
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Post by Mikie on Jan 18, 2019 13:04:14 GMT -5
Anyway, yeah. If you don't want to talk about politics then either don't include a political subforum or don't personally post on it. That would be my answer. I can think of other boards that folded because of it. Yep! Ed, you and I both watched a Beach Boys message board go down and out because of it.
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Post by The Cap'n on Jan 18, 2019 13:11:45 GMT -5
That would be my answer. I can think of other boards that folded because of it. Yep! Ed, you and I both watched a Beach Boys message board go down and out because of it. Only one?
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Post by Deleted on Jan 18, 2019 15:58:15 GMT -5
I generally don't like to post in these threads, and perhaps our football discuss should've been moved to the NFL thread, but I think one of the biggest problems facing the world is that people can't accept different views and just move on. People have lost the ability to discuss something they don't agree on in a civil manner. As a result, relatives and friends don't speak to each other. Heck, it's one of the reasons that the BB online fanbase needs separate forums. I agree with a lot of this. I think people huddling in their safe spaces where everyone agrees is definitely a big problem which has led to the rise of hyper-partisanship these days. The stereotype is the SJW "snowflakes" shutting out criticism, but it applies to the other side too with FOX news and dismissing anything that they don't like as "fake news." I blame the repeal of the fairness doctrine as well as social media for causing this problem. And yet...it's not always so clear cut as that either. I sincerely try to keep an open mind and engage other people in good faith, but I have my limits. As I always say in this situation, I dont care if we disagree on policy, but if you're gonna rely on fallacies, insult me personally, ignore what Im saying, argue in bad faith, then talking is pointless. During the 2016 election I followed the campaigns very closely and went back to watch old debates and speeches in order to contextualize it. I would write down my reactions to everything and share on social media, just for fun and to encourage my peers to take an interest in the process as well as our history. But you would not believe the blowback I got for doing so. See, I tried to be objective and call out the good campaign moves as well as my misgivings of all candidates, including third party. But it was nonstop shaming from Hillary-apologists that I'd dare to suggest the Trump campaign made even one strategically sound move. Not only that, some of my older relatives revealed a truly ugly side to them that year, posting about "trannies and fags" when they know I'm in that community, or commenting on my stuff just to tell me I'm stupid and have no right to vote until I own my own business. I either deleted or lost respect for a lot of people that year, not because we disagreed but because they were obnoxious, rude and borderline abusive over it.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 18, 2019 16:11:16 GMT -5
Some of the worst offenders, on social media especially, are friends whose values and views are similar to mine. I’m embarrassed and ashamed to associate with them because of the way they treat people with differing opinons. I’d much rather hang out with people whose views are opposite mine but who are considerate and respectful about it, than spend time with people whose values match mine but abuse those who disagree. It’s the #1 reason I don’t go on facebook anymore.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 18, 2019 16:24:27 GMT -5
To steer this back to the thread topic without abandoning the current debate in the thread, a person could argue that making everything political--and worse, partisan or tribal--is a really big issue. Now, I wouldn't call it in contention for "biggest problems facing the world." But it is problematic (at least in the U.S.; I can't speak for other places) when even traditional escapes become political arenas. Traditionally apolitical arenas are now seemingly filled with political messaging, and are subject to political commentators' loud judgment. Entertainment can't stop commenting on politics, and politics can't stop commenting on entertainment. To use a Seinfeldian phrase, worlds are colliding. Everyone has a right to speech, of course, but it's just sad when there's no room to breathe without attacking or being attacked.
It's why my earlier post in the thread referenced the so-called Golden Rule: it would go a long way if everyone would just cut everyone some slack sometimes (and not just in the "I cut people slack [except when they do or say something I disagree with]" kind of way). If every issue is a political issue--or even a moral issue, an issue of good v. evil--then there is literally no hope for general cultural peace. And yes, obviously I know I'm guilty of this problem, too. It's easy to see the problem, but hard to do one's part in fixing it. I'm trying to be conscious of it, to hold myself accountable, and to do better. I hope you'll go easy on me when I fail. I'll try to return the favor.
I agree with a lot of this as well. First and foremost, climate change should not be a partisan issue. In the rest of the world it isn't either. This is the survival of our species we're talking about, yet because the two-party system demands we take opposing sides on everything, for some reason we are still fighting about it. The UN report released a few months ago said we have ten years left to transfer to green infrastructure if we want to stave off the worst effects, and a few sources I've seen state that even this is an optimistic scenario and we're already too late. Yet this administration is doing nothing, even rolling back current environmental protections and propping up the coal industry. The overwhelming majority of scientists apparently aren't enough to convince some it isn't a conspiracy to sell more sunscreen (?!?) or some other such nonsense. At the same time, movies and TV shows should not be political battlegrounds either. I'm sick of every big tentpole movie having to star a woman or minority just so it can be billed as "the first time women have ever been funny!" / "the first female action star!" / "the first black superhero!" just to score brownie points. These stupid marketing campaigns were most notable for Ghostbusters, Wonder Woman (which is actually a great movie for what it's worth) and Black Panther. I'm not against giving women and minorities more spotlight, but I hate how it's used as a selling point. Not only that, billing each one as the first time is insulting to what came before. So...Tina Fey and Amy Poehler...Ripley, Thelma and Louise...Steel...those apparently never existed? What's worse, if you criticize these movies then you're framed as anti-women, anti-black, a stupid manbaby, a bigot. I'm sorry but I hate new Star Wars and Rey is a terribly written Mary Sue. No, Daisy Ridley, "Mary Sue" is not a sexist term. It's a real trope which denotes when a character is perfect and has no discernible flaws, weaknesses or vulnerability. This describes Rey to a tee. If you don't want criticism, make a better movie don't whine about how everyone in the world is out to get you. No, it wasn't Russians who downvoted Last Jedi on RottenTomatoes either--your movie just sucks. Like, people were attacking the AVGN two years ago, calling him sexist and a manbaby just for making this very reasonable, even-handed video: I think this issue with the films is part of a larger nefarious trend of companies being more and more blatantly anti-consumer the last ~15 odd years. But I'm not gonna get into that can of worms right now.
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Post by AGD on Jan 19, 2019 3:08:22 GMT -5
The two most divisive things in the world, now and going back to the dawn to cogent thought: politics and religion. Both capable of immense good, both toxic in the wrong hands. I don't usually comment on either (Trump isn't politics, he's entertainment).
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Post by Deleted on Jan 19, 2019 4:26:59 GMT -5
The two most divisive things in the world, now and going back to the dawn to cogent thought: politics and religion. Both capable of immense good, both toxic in the wrong hands. I don't usually comment on either (Trump isn't politics, he's entertainment). And where the two collide, (abortion), there never has been and I suspect never will be anything remotely resembling civil discourse.
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Post by E on Jan 19, 2019 5:37:27 GMT -5
Lack of tolerance.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 20, 2019 23:07:36 GMT -5
People who think they know everything about the USA and its politics, yet they don't even live in this country...…
All I've got to say on the matter.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 21, 2019 7:59:55 GMT -5
People who think they know everything about the USA and its politics, yet they don't even live in this country...… Agreed. In which case one has to tread with caution.
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Post by filledeplage on Jan 21, 2019 11:01:19 GMT -5
People who think they know everything about the USA and its politics, yet they don't even live in this country...… Agreed. In which case one has to tread with caution. And, when opining on someone else's country and their respective political system/s. We don't know if we are not there and know first-hand how things operate.
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