nater
Kahuna
Posts: 188
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Post by nater on Aug 31, 2022 13:05:24 GMT -5
I've always personally thought that The Beach Boys band should've been able to, at least, record&release live albums over the last 20+ years. "oH tHe LeGaCy" people cry, but Brian has released a plethora of live albums (in ranging quality) and so has the band (with more coming out nearly every year) so I truly feel that the legacy has been solidified for so long that these guys are absolute legends. In their own league, with the likes of very few, but including legends like Elvis, The Beatles, MJ, etc. They're one of the most iconic acts of the 20th, and now 21st century, for that matter, and to be honest, at the end of the day, SIP didn't irredeemably hurt the legacy, S&S didn't, TWGMTR and questionable C50 Live CD didn't.
If anything, especially by the time Totten became MD, that it's a SHAME that multiple live albums of the modern BBs touring band haven't been released. They could both document the AMAZING group Mike has put together, some of the insane setlists they do (particularly in Europe) and generate income both for BRI, but also for Brian, Mike, and other songwriters on the royalties/publishing side of things.
Totten is insanely talented at what he does, and with Mike & Bruce, has brought the live act from what it sounded like in the 90's (minus Al and Carl) which wasn't always the most inspired or accurate sound, but since Totten took the reigns, things have never sounded as good for the band onstage since, 1980 before Carl left. Since then it was a rollercoaster until Totten ultimately saved the day, turning the band into a cool combination of "studio band" and "live rock band" they meticulously recreate the band's hit & deep cut arrangements w/ all the correct harmonies, layered guitars & keys, with important 'non rock band' elements like woodwinds and hand percussion.(w/ now 10-11 members depending on night) They also know when to turn up a notch and really rock out (a la Knebworth energy) on songs like Wild Honey, Rockaway Beach, Do You Wanna Dance, etc...
The quality on the recordings that Totten / Sam Hollander produced for Mike's RFTS & 12SidesofSummer albums are also some of the best sounding BBs solo music ever, and exactly what the band could aim for now for commercial success. The energy, enthusiasm, and great BB sound on the songs Rockaway Beach, California Sun Celestial Celebration, Finally It's Christmas, Must Be Christmas and Summertime Blues are outta sight!!!!!
I'd trust the BB name w/ the production team Mike has used since he stopped using Michael 'Autotune' Lloyd so much. Plus, you'd still have Bruce around adding so much authenticity and uniqueness to whatever the project was. He's probably w/ Christian, the most important, frequently used background singer in the live harmony stack, singing some of the hardest parts. And Bruce lending his co-lead vocals to Cal Girls and Getcha Back on ML's UTL album added a lot of authenticity to those songs.
I just look at all of the live releases bands who've managed to stay together like The BBs have, such as The Rolling Stones, The Ventures, The Righteous Brothers, ELO, etc have all recorded and released both live & studio recordings to add to the bands' vast catalogs and make $$$ particularly as souvenir items at shows, and as constant passive income (that does add up w/ these huge acts) through streaming .
I really am not the type of think the band's "legacy" was damaged by stuff like SIP and S&S, so I can't think of any reason to hold this kinda thing from going through back. Of course, Brian likely wouldn't care, and Al would probably be the most upset. But like with all their business dealings, an agreement couldn've been met. Maybe like the "Jeff Lynne's ELO" still being catagorized as major ELO releases on streaming platforms, they could've been released as "The Beach Boys with Mike Love & Bruce Johnston" type of thing. I wouldn't even have a problem with the releases just being the BBs. There are countless BBs tracks without all of the group's members (most of them in fact) and really since the 80's the name became a banner for multiple creative units. I'm bummed that I see all the cool Stones live albums, probably a dozen over the last 20 years, many of which were current releases and not vault releases, and I've always wished the BBs had gotten to do the same thing. Especially with what a talented, devoted band they have now. It's not too late either. Mike and Bruce have sounded really great on this 60th anniversary tour, If I were in charge, I'd hop on getting a C60 Live album, and maybe even some new studio material from the BeachBoys (M&B) band asap!
How do you feel ?
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Post by newbbfan on Aug 31, 2022 13:18:01 GMT -5
I very much appreciate the reasoned and impassioned argument you make but I would not be interested. I saw one of the recent shows and I heard somebody I never heard of before singing wouldn't it be nice and Good Vibrations off key. For the songs where Bruce and Mike sing there's a great authenticity and the drummer is a great great singer and was fantastic on a song like darling. But a whole show where 80% of it is essentially a beach boy tribute band I would not want to hear at all. Would much rather hear some well recorded performances from the 50th reunion that were filmed but never really actualized in a great great live album. Though the life album that did come out of there I believe is not nearly as bad as some people have said. So yeah I appreciate your effort in this regard but not interested at all in hearing this show. Though will continue to go to them live for the excitement of seeing two actual Beach Boys on stage.
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Post by AGD on Aug 31, 2022 13:33:00 GMT -5
Legally, they can't. It's a condition of the license that they can't record as The Beach Boys, only tour.
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Post by lonelysummer on Aug 31, 2022 13:50:43 GMT -5
I don't need dozens of live recordings documenting EVERY tour. I think one album representing the last 10 years would be nice, though. The remakes on Unleash the Love should have been live recordings. I've enjoyed Mike's recent solo albums, but look at the credits, who sings and plays on them - they are basically albums by Mike's Beach Boys. He doesn't even sing lead on every song. A DVD would be even nicer, but that's less likely due to synchronization rights.
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Post by Rick Bartlett on Aug 31, 2022 17:44:16 GMT -5
Yeah, I think they, as in 'Mike and Bruce' should have been more focused on more recordings over the years. I'm not even talking big or large scale product, even music product they sell at their shows alone. Call it 'Mike and Bruce of...' or whatever. People kind of know what they're buying when they are at a show by that point. They could have made a handful of good cover albums, live shows with deep cuts, and just print a limited run of each. Cut out the middle man, and sell directly from the show or from their website. Your talking to a guy though who doesn't mind listening to 'NASCAR' or the 'Summertime Cruisin' album, so maybe I've set the bar too low, but I find them enjoyable enough to rip out every other year and give em' a spin. Kind of crazy really, when they've had the best outfit of the group for sometime now, and there's not a good representation of it preserved, besides your TV appearances/spots.
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Post by Jim on Aug 31, 2022 23:25:39 GMT -5
I'm very, very glad they can't release music on their own under The Beach Boys name, but at the same time I think it's a damn shame that Bruce has seemingly wasted at least about 30 years of his career as songwriter and studio singer. He's spoken of the fact that he's made music all of these years, but the only proof of him as a creative talent, say...post 1990 is what? "Slow Summer Dancin' (One Summer Night)" from Summer In Paradise, the Symphonic Sounds orchestral album, the recording of "She Believes In Love Again" featured on the California Music album and the instrumental "Sports Theme" from the Not For Sale compilation. I think that's about it.
Oh and he has that new cut on The Weeknd album, which is pretty good actually.
But besides that he's been MIA creatively. Not that I think he's a great, great talent, but his early surf music is kinda nice, he wrote a few good tunes for The Beach Boys, and of course he wrote the great "Don't Run Away" with Mike Love. I wouldn't have minded hearing a bit more from him.
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Post by E on Sept 1, 2022 2:10:48 GMT -5
Thanks, but no
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Post by monolithic on Sept 1, 2022 7:54:16 GMT -5
It's a shame that Mike didn't issue a live album under his own name (maybe around the 2008 U.K. shows), but it's understandable that it didn't happen. It would almost be advertising to people that they are not paying to see the real Beach Boys.
Using the group's name on any release would be neither possible nor desirable.
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Post by lonesurf on Sept 1, 2022 15:44:32 GMT -5
This is what the touring Monkees sold at late Eighties concerts to get around licensing problems. They must have sold a ton of these at merch stands:
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Post by ironhorseapples on Sept 1, 2022 16:12:23 GMT -5
Uh, no
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Post by ian on Sept 1, 2022 19:26:05 GMT -5
It’s hard to imagine that such an album would really be worthwhile but then again to my mind a live album has to deliver something different/special or I’d rather listen to the original recordings. Some live albums are great because they have incredible energy or more extended versions but since M and B are more about presenting the old songs as close to the original record as currently possible-it is unlikely to be a necessary live album. To be clear I don’t listen to Brian’s live albums, though I own them and I seldom ever listen to Knebworth (I might however occasionally watch the video)
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Post by lonelysummer on Sept 1, 2022 20:01:17 GMT -5
This is what the touring Monkees sold at late Eighties concerts to get around licensing problems. They must have sold a ton of these at merch stands: Some people love this album, but to my ears, the magic of seeing the 3 of them together didn't translate to vinyl. I don't need to hear Monkees hits with a horn section in the mix - how many of their hits had horns on them? Do we really need synths on I'm a Believer? It's probably a nice souvenir for those who saw them on that tour.
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Post by lonesurf on Sept 1, 2022 22:05:45 GMT -5
I agree that The Monkees disc was mostly a nice keepsake of that (surprisingly successful) tour. It was campy and fun … but also seemingly a big seller. Btw, coming back to Nater’s original post, below is the Facebook link for The Beach Boys Cruise. The 2022 recap video seems to have a relatively new (and complete) studio version of Good Vibrations, featuring the touring band. I'm not a Facebook person & am unsure how to post the video here, or how to save it as a sound file (maybe someone else can), but it's not a bad version. www.facebook.com/thebeachboyscruise/
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Post by Jim on May 21, 2023 23:23:19 GMT -5
I gotta ask nater....which Beach Boys stuff do you prefer?
Is it stuff like Today!, Summer Days, Pet Sounds, Sunflower and Surf's Up? Or if you had your druthers would it be Still Cruisin', Summer in Paradise and Stars and Stripes? I'm not trying to be mean either, as it's very likely one could catch me many times a year listening to "Somewhere Near Japan", "Island Girl", "In My Car", "Kokomo" or "Make It Big" among others. It just seems like you're more into the current day touring band and Mike's solo work, which I find curious. I myself have CD copies of Unleash The Love and 12 Sides of Summer and I'll very likely buy his supposed new album (titled Mike Love Not War right?) if it gets released. Shoot, I even enjoy stuff like Bruce's "Sports Theme" and that new Dean Torrence compilation. But I can't imagine somebody seriously preferring any of that stuff to the earlier stuff.
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Post by Awesoman on May 22, 2023 7:26:02 GMT -5
Nah. We don't need anything from Mike's group masquerading under the "Beach Boys" moniker. Brian and Al have released live albums but under their respective names rather than using the band's name. I think Mike's prolific(?) solo career is good enough.
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Post by Micha on May 22, 2023 11:00:08 GMT -5
The 2012 live album sounded... for lacking a more figurative English word... terrible. Even though the concerts were good, so don't bother.
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Post by filledeplage on May 22, 2023 11:03:42 GMT -5
Legally, they can't. It's a condition of the license that they can't record as The Beach Boys, only tour. This.
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nater
Kahuna
Posts: 188
Likes: 352
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Post by nater on May 22, 2023 11:44:50 GMT -5
I understand that with the way the rules are set up right now this wouldn't be possible. That's why the thread is called "Hypothetical" ... just a 'what if' scenario.
And Jim, that's an interesting question. Of course, I'd say that the albums between Today and Holland are the group at their objective 'best'. But I love it all. I'm just so in love with this band and their music. I love the classic hit era, the more progressive era, and even their later nostalgia era. I genuinely love SIP, S&S, NPP, and UTL. I genuinely love SMiLE and Surf's UP. I love the solo stuff, the live stuff, even the re-record stuff. So to make that decision as to ultimately what I like the most is impossible. Today I woke up in a KTSA mood. Yesterday I listened to BWPS and the Dean Torrence comp you mentioned. I guess I'm just so deep down this BBs rabbit hole that I get just as much enjoyment from stuff like SIP as Pet Sounds. Of course the latter is the superior artistic statement, but BBs music (from all eras) makes me happy, relaxed, and at peace in my heart. So I don't care if the masses hate stuff like MIU and S&S. I really, truly, love their whole catalog (and related discographies too like J&D and The Rip Chords)
Also Jim, you pointed out that it seems like I'm "more interested" in the current touring band. Well, I'd say I'm equally interested in the band's entire career, as well as Brian and Al's bands/careers. I just have been seeing the BBs in concert since 2014, so Mike's band is definitely legitimately The Beach Boys band to me. I definitely have an affinity and appreciation for the M&B BBs band for being the BBs that I've grown up following and seeing multiple times a year with my family. They're "my" BBs that I've grown up seeing.
I really just am so impressed and blown away by the fact that we're lucky enough to still have our favorite band active in their 61st year. So few groups make it to this point.
I love The BBs more than practically anything besides family and my work (also music). Every day they bring a smile to my face and I have their songs constantly flowing through my mind. I have equal love and respect for each era, each member, each piece of music, each respective touring group. I just love the entire story. The entire saga. The highs the lows, the ups the downs. Each member having his own personality, contributions, and story. The way the group of five guys from Hawthorne has evovled into a huge musical family between all the touring/session players, the sons/daughters, their peers like J&D... It's just such a rich, deep world to immerse yourself into. Ever since I got this "BBs bug" I've never gotten enough! I cherish every release. Every concert. Every article, book, internet clip, etc... I just can't state enough how much joy The BBs bring me.
Maybe I'm a sentimental sap.
I see that practically no one liked this, once again, hypothetical concept I proposed, but to be fair I expected that and have enjoyed the conversation nonetheless.
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Post by John Manning on May 22, 2023 18:44:33 GMT -5
I'd say that the albums between Today and Holland are the group at their objective 'best'. But I love it all. I'm just so in love with this band and their music. I love the classic hit era, the more progressive era, and even their later nostalgia era. I genuinely love SIP, S&S, NPP, and UTL. I genuinely love SMiLE and Surf's UP. I love the solo stuff, the live stuff, even the re-record stuff. So to make that decision as to ultimately what I like the most is impossible. Today I woke up in a KTSA mood. Yesterday I listened to BWPS and the Dean Torrence comp you mentioned. I guess I'm just so deep down this BBs rabbit hole that I get just as much enjoyment from stuff like SIP as Pet Sounds. Of course the latter is the superior artistic statement, but BBs music (from all eras) makes me happy, relaxed, and at peace in my heart. So I don't care if the masses hate stuff like MIU and S&S. I really, truly, love their whole catalog (and related discographies too like J&D and The Rip Chords)
Also Jim, you pointed out that it seems like I'm "more interested" in the current touring band. Well, I'd say I'm equally interested in the band's entire career, as well as Brian and Al's bands/careers. I just have been seeing the BBs in concert since 2014, so Mike's band is definitely legitimately The Beach Boys band to me. I definitely have an affinity and appreciation for the M&B BBs band for being the BBs that I've grown up following and seeing multiple times a year with my family. They're "my" BBs that I've grown up seeing.
I really just am so impressed and blown away by the fact that we're lucky enough to still have our favorite band active in their 61st year. So few groups make it to this point.
I love The BBs more than practically anything besides family and my work (also music). Every day they bring a smile to my face and I have their songs constantly flowing through my mind. I have equal love and respect for each era, each member, each piece of music, each respective touring group. I just love the entire story. The entire saga. The highs the lows, the ups the downs. Each member having his own personality, contributions, and story. The way the group of five guys from Hawthorne has evovled into a huge musical family between all the touring/session players, the sons/daughters, their peers like J&D... It's just such a rich, deep world to immerse yourself into. Ever since I got this "BBs bug" I've never gotten enough! I cherish every release. Every concert. Every article, book, internet clip, etc... I just can't state enough how much joy The BBs bring me.
Maybe I'm a sentimental sap.
This. All of this.
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Post by Al S on May 23, 2023 1:30:33 GMT -5
I don’t think M&B should be touring as The Beach Boys - yes, yes, licencing, easy money etc - let alone releasing studio content under the name.
So it’s a “Yeah, nah” from me, but it doesn’t cause me pain.
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Post by John Manning on May 23, 2023 5:08:10 GMT -5
I’m okay with the live band – though I’m basing that on what I saw when Scott and John were in the band. The live band’s had sidesmen since the late 1960s, Brian gave up touring in the early/mid 60s, Carl and Dennis are gone, Ricky and Blondie departed… there’s always been transition, and Scott in particular brought a lot of energy and talent that improved that live act. Some of those current/recent sidesmen – in the same way that Billy Hinsche, Jeff Foskett et al did – have earned their right to be members of The Beach Boys, to be Beach Boys in terms of the live act.
Studio stuff is a different matter. That’s sacrosanct. While there are founder members and former full members still around, no one else should pick up that badge. Every Beach Boy past and present, living or dead, sacked or departed, has released solo stuff under their own name and that’s the way it oughta be.
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Post by petejack on May 23, 2023 11:56:31 GMT -5
I understand that with the way the rules are set up right now this wouldn't be possible. That's why the thread is called "Hypothetical" ... just a 'what if' scenario.
And Jim, that's an interesting question. Of course, I'd say that the albums between Today and Holland are the group at their objective 'best'. But I love it all. I'm just so in love with this band and their music. I love the classic hit era, the more progressive era, and even their later nostalgia era. I genuinely love SIP, S&S, NPP, and UTL. I genuinely love SMiLE and Surf's UP. I love the solo stuff, the live stuff, even the re-record stuff. So to make that decision as to ultimately what I like the most is impossible. Today I woke up in a KTSA mood. Yesterday I listened to BWPS and the Dean Torrence comp you mentioned. I guess I'm just so deep down this BBs rabbit hole that I get just as much enjoyment from stuff like SIP as Pet Sounds. Of course the latter is the superior artistic statement, but BBs music (from all eras) makes me happy, relaxed, and at peace in my heart. So I don't care if the masses hate stuff like MIU and S&S. I really, truly, love their whole catalog (and related discographies too like J&D and The Rip Chords)
Also Jim, you pointed out that it seems like I'm "more interested" in the current touring band. Well, I'd say I'm equally interested in the band's entire career, as well as Brian and Al's bands/careers. I just have been seeing the BBs in concert since 2014, so Mike's band is definitely legitimately The Beach Boys band to me. I definitely have an affinity and appreciation for the M&B BBs band for being the BBs that I've grown up following and seeing multiple times a year with my family. They're "my" BBs that I've grown up seeing.
I really just am so impressed and blown away by the fact that we're lucky enough to still have our favorite band active in their 61st year. So few groups make it to this point.
I love The BBs more than practically anything besides family and my work (also music). Every day they bring a smile to my face and I have their songs constantly flowing through my mind. I have equal love and respect for each era, each member, each piece of music, each respective touring group. I just love the entire story. The entire saga. The highs the lows, the ups the downs. Each member having his own personality, contributions, and story. The way the group of five guys from Hawthorne has evovled into a huge musical family between all the touring/session players, the sons/daughters, their peers like J&D... It's just such a rich, deep world to immerse yourself into. Ever since I got this "BBs bug" I've never gotten enough! I cherish every release. Every concert. Every article, book, internet clip, etc... I just can't state enough how much joy The BBs bring me.
Maybe I'm a sentimental sap.
I see that practically no one liked this, once again, hypothetical concept I proposed, but to be fair I expected that and have enjoyed the conversation nonetheless.
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Post by Jim on May 24, 2023 22:49:32 GMT -5
I understand that with the way the rules are set up right now this wouldn't be possible. That's why the thread is called "Hypothetical" ... just a 'what if' scenario.
And Jim, that's an interesting question. Of course, I'd say that the albums between Today and Holland are the group at their objective 'best'. But I love it all. I'm just so in love with this band and their music. I love the classic hit era, the more progressive era, and even their later nostalgia era. I genuinely love SIP, S&S, NPP, and UTL. I genuinely love SMiLE and Surf's UP. I love the solo stuff, the live stuff, even the re-record stuff. So to make that decision as to ultimately what I like the most is impossible. Today I woke up in a KTSA mood. Yesterday I listened to BWPS and the Dean Torrence comp you mentioned. I guess I'm just so deep down this BBs rabbit hole that I get just as much enjoyment from stuff like SIP as Pet Sounds. Of course the latter is the superior artistic statement, but BBs music (from all eras) makes me happy, relaxed, and at peace in my heart. So I don't care if the masses hate stuff like MIU and S&S. I really, truly, love their whole catalog (and related discographies too like J&D and The Rip Chords)
Also Jim, you pointed out that it seems like I'm "more interested" in the current touring band. Well, I'd say I'm equally interested in the band's entire career, as well as Brian and Al's bands/careers. I just have been seeing the BBs in concert since 2014, so Mike's band is definitely legitimately The Beach Boys band to me. I definitely have an affinity and appreciation for the M&B BBs band for being the BBs that I've grown up following and seeing multiple times a year with my family. They're "my" BBs that I've grown up seeing.
I really just am so impressed and blown away by the fact that we're lucky enough to still have our favorite band active in their 61st year. So few groups make it to this point.
I love The BBs more than practically anything besides family and my work (also music). Every day they bring a smile to my face and I have their songs constantly flowing through my mind. I have equal love and respect for each era, each member, each piece of music, each respective touring group. I just love the entire story. The entire saga. The highs the lows, the ups the downs. Each member having his own personality, contributions, and story. The way the group of five guys from Hawthorne has evovled into a huge musical family between all the touring/session players, the sons/daughters, their peers like J&D... It's just such a rich, deep world to immerse yourself into. Ever since I got this "BBs bug" I've never gotten enough! I cherish every release. Every concert. Every article, book, internet clip, etc... I just can't state enough how much joy The BBs bring me.
Maybe I'm a sentimental sap.
I see that practically no one liked this, once again, hypothetical concept I proposed, but to be fair I expected that and have enjoyed the conversation nonetheless.
Must say that though I can't say we share the same viewpoint I gotta respect your love for this stuff.
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Post by Al S on May 25, 2023 4:12:09 GMT -5
I see that practically no one liked this, once again, hypothetical concept I proposed, but to be fair I expected that and have enjoyed the conversation nonetheless.
Don't let that stop ya, I'm looking forward to the next one - M&B Present Smile, perhaps?
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tonyw
Dude/Dudette
Posts: 93
Likes: 123
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Post by tonyw on May 25, 2023 17:25:14 GMT -5
I see that practically no one liked this, once again, hypothetical concept I proposed, but to be fair I expected that and have enjoyed the conversation nonetheless.
Don't let that stop ya, I'm looking forward to the next one - M&B Present Smile, perhaps? YES!
I can't wait to hear the reworked lyrics
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